It’s interesting to note that the response of a professional (who should be able to explain his idiosyncratic prescribing patterns in simple, medical terms) is to recruit the legal equivalent of a henchman or bully.
All medical professionals have indemnity insurance to cover this situation. That Dr Dan has resorted to using an adversarial lawyer rather than his indemnity insurer for legal advice should tell you a great deal about the issue. Indemnity insurance tends to be critical to the practitioner who does not want to discuss the issue in an open and reasonable way. Generally, all disputes of this nature can be resolved with a civilised conversation, in their view.
In short, that he’s employed the “big dogs” to threaten you, suggests that he’s taken legal advice from his insurer who has told him that he has no legal leg to stand on.
The exact same thing tends to happen in disputes over NZ construction contracts, strangely. NZ is such a small country - the lawyers who bully and bluster are well known!
Thanks for sharing this, David. And for not backing down to legal (and medical) bullies anymore. You are doing the world a favour by exposing misinformation and blowing the whistle. Maybe it even saves lives.
But I can relate to how much it sucks. It happened to me once, by proxy. An intrepid Kiwi journalist mate took it upon her to try and expose a very convoluted and awful story of what happened to a bunch of us female scientists on a trip to Antarctica. Led by a female Trump, the whole expedition turned into a nightmare. She infected us all with a terrible respiratory virus (pre-COVID, but her expedition leader ended up owning the ship that brought the pandemic to Antarctica 4 years later! They never learn…).
The mostly-male crew had a field day with the young girls on the ship. One woman was raped. She had a breakdown halfway through the journey, that us non-medical professionals had to try and help her with. Several others were sexually harassed/assaulted. We couldn’t leave (obviously, we were stuck in Antarctica!).
And to make things worse, a lot of the other women later turned on the victims and the few of us trying to fight for better conditions on future trips with extreme bullying and slut shaming. So much for the “sisterhood”. The greatest irony was that the whole expedition was meant to “combat sexism in science”. It was an utter shit show and ruined at least one good woman’s life and career.
We got one article published on Grist (called “On thin ice”) but our Spinoff article, which had more women coming forward, on the record, about sexual assault they suffered, had to be canned. Because the narcissist bully sicced her Australian lawyers on them, with (false) defamation claims. I understand why the Spinoff couldn’t take on the legal threat, it wasn’t an easy or straightforward story. I’m not sure it would have changed things, and maybe getting the victims’ names out would have been worse for them or their career. Covering up sexism in science is, after all, one of the defining traits of academia… Our internal fight at least improved some of the safety issues for future trips. But the bullies were never held to account, they kept doing the expeditions and raking in money, and the victims never even got acknowledged, including by their own peers. It is infuriatingly unfair.
The whole saga (I kept fighting them for almost 2 years to try and get some acknowledgment of the bad stuff that happened, to little avail) triggered my complex PTSD, which I’m still recovering from. I just started writing about my world saviour complex “for therapy” on Medium btw! Let’s hope it is therapeutic, and won’t get me into more sh*t. People like you give me courage. So, very long story short: Thank you, as always, for keeping up the good fight 💙
Oh my gosh - I am so sorry to hear about all this. Fucking hell. This is utter nightmare material. I won't go into it here, but the way privacy can be claimed to push back against being exposed - along with defamation - winds me up so, so much. Bad people just keep getting away with bad things. Fully optional, but if you don't mind sending me a few links to said things, would you mind? davidfarrier@protonmail.com
Hey David, is it almost a weird sort of complement that you’re important enough to send threatening letters to? (Dylan is definitely missing out). If Dr Dan thinks your article misrepresents his position he should probably reflect on the information he is promoting on social media. If the shoe fits…
Oh look, usually when people starting scrambling for lawyers you are doing something right, imo. Since D'Amato it's just become a way of life. It's weird. I hope Dr Dan writes a response I can publish and critique!
I would love to see it. I would really like to know if he genuinely believes and defends the positions he holds. Because by sharing dubious information he gives it legitimacy, and it’s like a wink and a nudge to the full-on conspiracy theorists and anti-vaxers.
That one's a stretch isn't it? Last I checked a defamation defence based on "because I didn't like it" doesn't really fly.
So glad you're not intimidated by legalese and are pushing back. Here in Australia we've seen a rise in high profile defamation cases coming from politicians in particular and it's a grubby trend.
I just want to join the crowd by saying I love what you write. It’s honest and refreshing. Don’t let a few narky letters from a lawyer get you down. Besides, it’s a big difference between a letter being sent and actually proceeding to a court case. Most of the times it’s just to scare you.
I loved your reply to them. Brilliant.
Go you!
I’m also quite sure that I’d put a few coin into a gofundme, or whatever, if it came to helping you fight legal shite to print the truth.
David, I think you are quite brave and highly respectable to address this bs head on. Certainly the path of least resistance would be to submit to their demands, but you knew that wasn't right, and you didn't acquiesce. Plus, like, they just plain made shit up? I see no evidence of defamation as they are claiming. Anyway it's quite enlightening to see this side of what you are dealing with, and I'm glad as a subscriber to help in any small way to protect you from the nuts.
Thanks - I did give it some thought, and just because both cases were Chris Patterson... how could I not? I mean - it's objectively funny. And shows how shallow all this stuff is. But yeah - it also sucks. It takes time and stress and I'd rather not have to deal with it, for sure. But hey - it's a good piece for Webworm :)
Deep relate to this one! Thanks for sharing the letters too. I recently obtained many grey hairs with the threat of a defamation suit in the form of a scary 4 page letter from a big-ass scary lawyer with a QC rearing to go. Luckily got some amazing legal support to send a middle-finger of a letter back, rather than the $$ and apology they wanted. Unfortunately they don't have to write back and say "good points, you're right - we don't really have a case and we're just rich bullies who didn't like what you said about us" - so apparently you often just don't get replies to a rebuttal? No closure! They can just dump this stuff on you and hope you fold. Very stressful even if you know they have no case, huh? Love this approach and interested to see where it goes. If you need a name for a good lawyer specializing in defending defamation....let me know....(!)
That they don't reply in rebuttal is a subtle bonus. It's a tacit admission on their part that they don't have a leg to stand on and they were just trying it on. Take that as your closure — that you were right and they were gutless bullies.
Good on you for standing fast David, you're right to do so. If these people decide they want to "fuck around and find out" I'm sure your readers can deploy considerable resources to ensure the finding out is both righteous and entertaining. I've got a justice boner just thinking about it.
Damn straight these quacks need to be called out. How can someone use their title and vocation as a platform to spout clap-trap that is actually ‘injurious’ to the public good?! The guy could have people ingesting Ivermecten for f8&%’s sake! Calling this stuff out is in all of our best interests and it rankles me (but not surprised) that he had the gall to call the lawyers on this. Has the (so called) doctor have such an over-inflated sense of self he has lost sight of the hippocratic oath that sits at the heart of his profession? This is exactly why I subscribe, and support you David. Keep fighting the good fight!
Thanks Phil. I agree that people should think twice before posting every second study about alt covid treatments - especially when we should be focussed on getting people vaccinated.
Always happy to see legal threats to you that don't also have my name on them :-)
Typical. I will drag you into it somehow, Dylan....
This is why I don't ask for written credit on the stories I contribute research to :-)
Going to start putting your name in BOLD
Just a note at the end: "All defamatory comments courtesy of Dylan Reeve"
Great idea. You think I'm joking but I am running with this. Will add your contact info to the bottom
I'm happy to swear I saw Dylan hanging around the article looking furtive...
It’s interesting to note that the response of a professional (who should be able to explain his idiosyncratic prescribing patterns in simple, medical terms) is to recruit the legal equivalent of a henchman or bully.
All medical professionals have indemnity insurance to cover this situation. That Dr Dan has resorted to using an adversarial lawyer rather than his indemnity insurer for legal advice should tell you a great deal about the issue. Indemnity insurance tends to be critical to the practitioner who does not want to discuss the issue in an open and reasonable way. Generally, all disputes of this nature can be resolved with a civilised conversation, in their view.
In short, that he’s employed the “big dogs” to threaten you, suggests that he’s taken legal advice from his insurer who has told him that he has no legal leg to stand on.
Don’t back down. That’ll be their job!
Thanks Lloyd.
I am curious if he takes me up on this offer to respond publicly.
Curious what his writing ability is like.
The exact same thing tends to happen in disputes over NZ construction contracts, strangely. NZ is such a small country - the lawyers who bully and bluster are well known!
As another GP in NZ - I am absolutely loving your work David (and the t-shirt you sent me)
Callum - it is very nice to have GPs here - and there are a few. Makes me happy. Glad you like the tee. That also makes me very happy.
Thanks for sharing this, David. And for not backing down to legal (and medical) bullies anymore. You are doing the world a favour by exposing misinformation and blowing the whistle. Maybe it even saves lives.
But I can relate to how much it sucks. It happened to me once, by proxy. An intrepid Kiwi journalist mate took it upon her to try and expose a very convoluted and awful story of what happened to a bunch of us female scientists on a trip to Antarctica. Led by a female Trump, the whole expedition turned into a nightmare. She infected us all with a terrible respiratory virus (pre-COVID, but her expedition leader ended up owning the ship that brought the pandemic to Antarctica 4 years later! They never learn…).
The mostly-male crew had a field day with the young girls on the ship. One woman was raped. She had a breakdown halfway through the journey, that us non-medical professionals had to try and help her with. Several others were sexually harassed/assaulted. We couldn’t leave (obviously, we were stuck in Antarctica!).
And to make things worse, a lot of the other women later turned on the victims and the few of us trying to fight for better conditions on future trips with extreme bullying and slut shaming. So much for the “sisterhood”. The greatest irony was that the whole expedition was meant to “combat sexism in science”. It was an utter shit show and ruined at least one good woman’s life and career.
We got one article published on Grist (called “On thin ice”) but our Spinoff article, which had more women coming forward, on the record, about sexual assault they suffered, had to be canned. Because the narcissist bully sicced her Australian lawyers on them, with (false) defamation claims. I understand why the Spinoff couldn’t take on the legal threat, it wasn’t an easy or straightforward story. I’m not sure it would have changed things, and maybe getting the victims’ names out would have been worse for them or their career. Covering up sexism in science is, after all, one of the defining traits of academia… Our internal fight at least improved some of the safety issues for future trips. But the bullies were never held to account, they kept doing the expeditions and raking in money, and the victims never even got acknowledged, including by their own peers. It is infuriatingly unfair.
The whole saga (I kept fighting them for almost 2 years to try and get some acknowledgment of the bad stuff that happened, to little avail) triggered my complex PTSD, which I’m still recovering from. I just started writing about my world saviour complex “for therapy” on Medium btw! Let’s hope it is therapeutic, and won’t get me into more sh*t. People like you give me courage. So, very long story short: Thank you, as always, for keeping up the good fight 💙
Oh my gosh - I am so sorry to hear about all this. Fucking hell. This is utter nightmare material. I won't go into it here, but the way privacy can be claimed to push back against being exposed - along with defamation - winds me up so, so much. Bad people just keep getting away with bad things. Fully optional, but if you don't mind sending me a few links to said things, would you mind? davidfarrier@protonmail.com
Thanks again. Reading this shook me.
Hey David, is it almost a weird sort of complement that you’re important enough to send threatening letters to? (Dylan is definitely missing out). If Dr Dan thinks your article misrepresents his position he should probably reflect on the information he is promoting on social media. If the shoe fits…
Oh look, usually when people starting scrambling for lawyers you are doing something right, imo. Since D'Amato it's just become a way of life. It's weird. I hope Dr Dan writes a response I can publish and critique!
I would love to see it. I would really like to know if he genuinely believes and defends the positions he holds. Because by sharing dubious information he gives it legitimacy, and it’s like a wink and a nudge to the full-on conspiracy theorists and anti-vaxers.
That one's a stretch isn't it? Last I checked a defamation defence based on "because I didn't like it" doesn't really fly.
So glad you're not intimidated by legalese and are pushing back. Here in Australia we've seen a rise in high profile defamation cases coming from politicians in particular and it's a grubby trend.
Keep fighting the good fight!
Just subscribed based on this. Thank you for continuing to tell the un-filtered truth. Fucking refreshing.
Nico - hi. It's nice to have you here. Really. And pop into the comments anytime - we have good discussions in here.
I just want to join the crowd by saying I love what you write. It’s honest and refreshing. Don’t let a few narky letters from a lawyer get you down. Besides, it’s a big difference between a letter being sent and actually proceeding to a court case. Most of the times it’s just to scare you.
I loved your reply to them. Brilliant.
Go you!
I’m also quite sure that I’d put a few coin into a gofundme, or whatever, if it came to helping you fight legal shite to print the truth.
Believe me - thanks to Tickled, I know more than I ever want to know (and more than I can report).
And thank you - but being here is enough. You are subbed, it all helps (HEAPS)
This matters, You do important work, which is why I subscribe.
David, I think you are quite brave and highly respectable to address this bs head on. Certainly the path of least resistance would be to submit to their demands, but you knew that wasn't right, and you didn't acquiesce. Plus, like, they just plain made shit up? I see no evidence of defamation as they are claiming. Anyway it's quite enlightening to see this side of what you are dealing with, and I'm glad as a subscriber to help in any small way to protect you from the nuts.
Thanks - I did give it some thought, and just because both cases were Chris Patterson... how could I not? I mean - it's objectively funny. And shows how shallow all this stuff is. But yeah - it also sucks. It takes time and stress and I'd rather not have to deal with it, for sure. But hey - it's a good piece for Webworm :)
Deep relate to this one! Thanks for sharing the letters too. I recently obtained many grey hairs with the threat of a defamation suit in the form of a scary 4 page letter from a big-ass scary lawyer with a QC rearing to go. Luckily got some amazing legal support to send a middle-finger of a letter back, rather than the $$ and apology they wanted. Unfortunately they don't have to write back and say "good points, you're right - we don't really have a case and we're just rich bullies who didn't like what you said about us" - so apparently you often just don't get replies to a rebuttal? No closure! They can just dump this stuff on you and hope you fold. Very stressful even if you know they have no case, huh? Love this approach and interested to see where it goes. If you need a name for a good lawyer specializing in defending defamation....let me know....(!)
That they don't reply in rebuttal is a subtle bonus. It's a tacit admission on their part that they don't have a leg to stand on and they were just trying it on. Take that as your closure — that you were right and they were gutless bullies.
YES. This. All of this.
KUDOS for following through. It's very annoying and stressful and I am very glad you did it. You won!
Kia kaha David. Sharing these stories matters, just as much as not backing down to bullies. Wearing my Webworm Tshirt today in solidarity ❤👊
FUCKIN A! Thanks Shannon x
Good on you for standing fast David, you're right to do so. If these people decide they want to "fuck around and find out" I'm sure your readers can deploy considerable resources to ensure the finding out is both righteous and entertaining. I've got a justice boner just thinking about it.
Thanks Matt. People here are cool - and honestly, would never ask for more than a subscription. That does so much heavy lifting. Really.
Damn straight these quacks need to be called out. How can someone use their title and vocation as a platform to spout clap-trap that is actually ‘injurious’ to the public good?! The guy could have people ingesting Ivermecten for f8&%’s sake! Calling this stuff out is in all of our best interests and it rankles me (but not surprised) that he had the gall to call the lawyers on this. Has the (so called) doctor have such an over-inflated sense of self he has lost sight of the hippocratic oath that sits at the heart of his profession? This is exactly why I subscribe, and support you David. Keep fighting the good fight!
Thanks Phil. I agree that people should think twice before posting every second study about alt covid treatments - especially when we should be focussed on getting people vaccinated.
There's a reason I subscribe to you, my trust that you have researched and are sharing the facts.
Many eternal thanks Kathy
Thanks for sharing this with us David Transparency is powerful. Keep up your great work. Kia Kaha
Thanks Tracey.