"I think for so long I had to sit in the church and be subjected to really crazy teachings, and to be yelled at on Sunday and told that I was a terrible person. And then doubting it, and then being told that if I was doubting, it was because my faith wasn’t strong enough, and just being gaslit constantly. If I was doubting, then maybe you weren’t praying enough — there’s always an answer to put you in the wrong."
If this was a woman complaining about her husband doing this, we would all legit tell her she was in an abusive relationship and she should leave as soon as she is able. It breaks my heart that churches (and parents) do this to children.
The part where he talks about being born again at 5 years old. That unlocked a core memory for me, followed by a deluge of pieces falling into place.
I was 7 years old when I decided to be baptized. There was more fanfare in my house than any birthday or holiday. My parents invited the youth pastor over to… I don’t know… make sure I was ripe for the picking? Ew.
As a gay kid growing up against the backdrop of AIDS and the Satanic Panic, all I knew to be true was that I didn’t fit in. Anywhere. Even my own family.
So when, suddenly, I had everyone’s undivided attention, I started to understand the rules of the game. I even got my own Bible with an inscription and everything (A hippy, trippy Good News Bible if anyone remembers those)
But as the years went by the cracks started to show. I wasn’t accepted. I was being told to change everything about myself. The God who loved me unconditionally, actually had a lot of conditions. If I didn’t fall in line, I’d be tormented for all eternity. Because… love.
Now I’m 50 years old, re-raising myself while parenting my 5-year-old daughter. It’s been 2+ years of weekly therapy appointments. I’ve done Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. I’ve dug up so many old, forgotten wounds in an effort to heal them. The self-talk never ends. It’s constant. Always reminding myself that it’s ok for me to take up space on this planet.
Thank you for posting this, David. ❤️ My neurons are firing all over the place. Thank puppies that Christian Nightmares exists.
Hey Jay - I know this can be a lot. So while I am glad this unlocked some stuff, also just take care because these memories flooding back can be a *trip*. It sounds from what you say you are taking care, and have done the work - but yeah, isn't it fucking mad what we forget. And so much of that forgotten stuff *shaped us*.
I just remember it SO vividly now, it's hard to believe I had completely buried it for this long. Definitely trippy. It helps I had already processed my Jesus cookies, but that's another story for another day.
You and me both. It’s astounding how many people have stories with similar threads to my own. I vividly remember getting baptised at age ten purely because my older brother did, and how much I craved the attention he received.
Similar to you, I grew up in the 90s in the shadow of the AIDs pandemic and the Grim Reaper - bowling ad campaign here in Australia (Google that shit, it’s awful). So being indoctrinated in and out of the church with a message that said basically all gays get AIDS and die, it’s not hard to imagine how terrified and full of self loathing I was when I worked out I was gay.
Like a lot of us, I’ve spent thousands on therapy to unwork all of this. I felt like sending the bill to c3 in exchange for the unknown amount I gave in tithing to an organisation that was slowly destroying me.
The indoctrination is insidious. The biggest hurdle in healing from those wounds is admitting it was abusive in the first place. But of course if I call Christianity a cult at family functions it doesn't go over well. 🤷♂️
It’s a hard one because I don’t see any issues with Christianity as a faith (if Christian’s actually read their bibles) it’s the church at large I have issues with, and I’m pretty sure Jesus would too based on his teachings.
I just wanted to query the appointment of Brent Cameron considering the independent report interviewing hundreds of interns about his behaviour and the frankly horrific abuse.
I've mentioned before that I've grown up Christian and still am. I've completed a Youth Ministry Internship, I've led in youth ministries, and I've been involved in various Churches. I've always had a problem with a lot of what Church culture is. So much judgement, maintaining appearances etc. I cant stand pentecostal prosperity faithluencing (my word) weird stuff. Don't get me started on tele-evangelism. My faith at least is not in weird preachers or people, and despite all the unanswered questions I still choose to believe. The type of Church i appreciate are the ones running support services for people struggling with addiction, trying to get out of debt, thiose suffering violence and abuse, those without homes. That's the kind of Church i can get behind. The rest of this crap makes me sick and/or cringe...or both
It's been my observation, as someone who grew up as a complete heathen, that religion is a human construct that acts as an organising principle, an amplifier for the human that already exists.
So you get churches that amplify fear and anxiety in their people, and you get the ones that amplify the Cameron bro's avaricious, authoritarian streak.
But you also get the ones that amplify the grace and manaaki of their members, and that's a beautiful thing.
I recently came out as bisexual as in a month ago. I also work for a church and will keep their name anonymous just due to their policies of social media. When I came out to them, they embraced me with loving arms and welcomed me into living in my truth. It’s been an amazing experience.
With that being said, I agree with the gaslit statement for a lot of churches. It’s not about the good you do, but about the wrong that has yet to be committed. Hell, you’re fucked at birth in their eyes because you’re born a sinner despite being not able to walk, talk, crawl, chew solid food, or have a conscience thought. This is their belief. It’s the ultimate guilt trip into keeping you coming back so they can not only take your hard earned money, but indoctrinate you into their core values so they have voter and influence in the community and nation. It’s beyond disturbing. But there is a reason their numbers in these places of worship are dwindling. Not all churches are losing people, but a good deal are losing members. People are tired of being guilt tripped. Though sadly this shit will still exist for quite sometime. Maybe indefinitely or until the collapse of human civilization.
I appreciate it. I owe coming out partly due to you. But I didn’t say to that make it sound like church is wonderful or to promote me. It’s more about how churches refuse to evolve as well as letting go of prejudices and bias that they use to control others and bring hatred to human kind. I recognize how fortunate I am, but it’s not like that for millions of others. I heard it said in an AA group that we grow resentful of the God of our ancestors which is this very hateful figure.
How can their Christian teachings promote a God of hatred and prejudice? Jesus was an immigrant and if humans were created in Gods images, wouldn’t being a person of color, a different nationality or a sexual orientation be ok as it reflects the creator? These people are assholes and I appreciate how you call them on it.
I think people like that are only religous because it indulges their desire to feel superior with very little actual work. Being open and accepting, turning the other cheek, giving to the poor. Stuff like that involves humility and introspection, and isn't as inherently appealing as "God hates all the same people you do, and he wants you to live in a mansion and drive a nice car."
Glad that you feel comfortable in your surroundings and that you have the support from people who should be there to love and support - not judge - not only their fellow parishioners but also the rest of the community writ large. From your previous posts (and restaurant recommendations, of which I've done a few) we're in the same state and what that environment can be like, especially in more rural areas. I didn't realize it until later, but I was in a much more open, accepting, and supportive denomination growing up (even at the mountain retreat down the highway in H'ville) and I can only wish that to be the environment others could have experienced. Learning about this entirely opposite side of the religious spectrum that I thought was the unusual and rare has really been eye-opening to me. I've had many LGBT+ friends who've been shunned by their churches or hidden themselves while working there, but also seen plenty who have found congregations that embrace and love them and where they find a place where they belong and can thrive.
This brings to mind Hayden's article about all the similarities between Trump and the Antichrist. It's less literally true, and more people haven't really changed that much in the past two millienia. It's not prophecy, just human nature.
I don't have much religous baggage, but I was very sick as a child, and if you'd ask me a couple years ago what impact it still had on me as an adult, I probably would've brushed it off. But as I've dealt with some less serious health issues lately, all of it has started bubbling back up again. And as I've been unpacking it more, so much of the way I think and act, things I don't like about myself, seems to have its roots in my childhood.
I guess what I'm really saying is we could all use a lot more therapy. Except the Camerons, I have a feeling it woud just make them worse. Fuck those guys.
"I spent most of my early 20s whining about how God doesn’t exist. The faith I’d held was crumbling, and being replaced in my mind by a huge deposit of angst. I made whole albums bemoaning the newly empty sky; the sudden void where heaven, hope, and meaning used to be. “Wah wah wah,” I moaned. “You only get one call but there’s no telephone.”
It’s been 15 years since then, and I’m pleased to admit in light of recent events, I may have overreacted. The Bible I once nitpicked over its stances on shellfish and whether it’s okay to have kids eaten by bears if they hassle you for being bald is making a huge comeback. It may not be perfect on the issue of killing every firstborn son in Egypt but it’s hard to get mad when its ancient texts are laying out our current situation with an accuracy so eerie it would make Nostradamus shart in jealousy. I’m talking, of course, about how Donald Trump is clearly, irrefutably the Antichrist as described in the prophetic Biblical books of Daniel and Revelation."
Always pleased you are doing this. Two days ago, I thought I was strong enough to finally start the redress journey, since the dam awful NZ government has made us survivors have to do it for ourselves, again. It feels like the royal commission into abuse in state and faith-based care was a failure. I have two cases, one with the Salvation Army, which terrifies me as I don't believe they will say sorry, and the other with the Ministry of Health. I phoned the MoH and was told the man who does the historical claims is away on holiday. So, after everything the government said and all the millions they poured into the Ministries to make the process easier for us survivors, we have just found out that it is yet another lie by this government. I wrote my email and included huge amounts of records showing abuse, hit send, and now knowing only one man will look at it, god knows when his holiday ends or what his backlog is like? I am too scared of the Salvation Army, and knowing people like what you wrote above, I feel deflated. Two days later, I feel like evil always wins, the cesspit always rises to the top. I am going to go and watch some daft animals on TikTok, it's the only thing keeping me laughing.
To me this encapsulates the entirety of organised religion:
“And then doubting it, and then being told that if I was doubting, it was because my faith wasn’t strong enough, and just being gaslit constantly. If I was doubting, then maybe you weren’t praying enough — there’s always an answer to put you in the wrong.”
Gaslighting has been the foundation of organised religion since the beginning
So much gaslighting! As a teen, I asked genuine questions. Instead of answers, I endured the laying on of hands to cast out the demons of doubt. Then those demons of doubt seemed to be multiplying and had to be cast out regularly at services. I was also infected by the demons of vegetarianism, and ... astrology, after I pointed out some constellations at a youth camp. Anything they didn't like/ understand is a freakin'demon! ( I left !)
I really enjoyed reading your interview with the Christian Nightmares guy, David. I feel for anyone raised in a fundamentalist household. I’ve been reflecting on Brent Cameron’s appt with Kingdom Hope Church. I’m a Christian and a pastor and a big part of our message is about forgiveness and second chances. But I believe that message gets confused with a person being restored to active pastoral ministry. When someone has been found guilty of ongoing abuse, that should disqualify them from ministry. Of course they can/should be restored to a church community but it’s not appropriate for them to once again assume the role of pastor.
Totally. I also think there's the thing with Brent and John where they never actually apologised, or said they were at fault.
It was all blame shifting - and at times, actively pushing back against those who came forward (and leaving the likes of Charlotte Cummings with $20k in bills to pay: https://www.webworm.co/p/charlottelegalfees)
That’s very true, David. A dear friend is a Jewish theologian and he speaks about the concept of T’Shuva in Judaism. The Christian equivalent is repentance. It involves five steps:
1. Acknowledging that I’ve done the wrong thing.
2. Expressing remorse.
3. Seeking forgiveness which is often an ongoing process that can’t be rushed. And it’s about the person who’s been wronged - not about making ME feel better.
4. Taking steps to rectify the wrongdoing if possible.
5. Avoid repeating the behaviour.
Clearly the Camerons have dodged sme of these. Only time will tell if the behaviour is repeated and others are abused. Sadly, that’s often been the case in the Christian church.
I totally hear you about terrible shit coming back around once again, particularly in Christian circles. I had that same feeling when a post about Michael Tait (ex DC Talk of the 1990s) being accused of sexual assault popped into my Facebook feed last month. It's like once again, someone with a hugely public profile in Christian circles has been revealed to be a dodgy bawbag. What the fuck is wrong with evangelical Christianity, particularly the hyped-up mega-church that gave the world the Christian music scene and tele-evangelists. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/jun/13/michael-tait-sexual-assault-allegations
That was a crazy thing to see unfold. Michael Tait essentially said, "Yes, I did that stuff" in an instagram post. Newsboys tour on, not saying a lot. And their management - so gross. Nashville is a strange, closeted town.
Learning about gentle Jesus and watching the nuns lay into my fellow pupils with a strap kind of put me off believing anything they said about heaven and hell.
I started questioning my religion (Lutheran) around age 14. Especially when it came to LGBTQ+ issues and abortion. Probably why I majored in Religious Studies. 🤣
I went back to religion a bit after my dad died as it made me feel closer to him. But after a while I started to snap out of my depression and realized that lifestyle and faith is 100% NOT ME. I do believe in something. Like a higher energy but the Christian God? Nope.
I also don’t want to teach all of that to my children. Being taught to fear God’s wrath and worried you will burn in hell for “sins” is fucking brutal and heavy to impose on young minds. I have a children’s book on World Religions, if my they are ever interested. I will never stop them from wanting to learn and explore it. To me faith is personal and should be discovered on your own.
I love the Christian Nightmares account. Reading this was great! Another one I follow on IG is Eve Was Framed. Her name is Promise and she is the daughter of a preacher turned Athiest. It’s appalling to see the comments she receives from so called loving Christians. She gets labelled a Jezebel, a whore, and many other insults, but has great rebuttals and insights due to her upbringing.
But…this is a religion I believe we all could get behind:
Childhood wounds are so very hard to heal and put behind us, even if they are from supposed ‘good’ places like church*shudder* Sending love to all that have been hurt
None of the 'churches' that are taking on the Camerons, either as pastors or speakers, are the least bit concerned about their backgrounds because they fit like a glove into their own practices - they're all doing it too.
And any of the "negative press" (ie saying out loud what they've been doing) will just feed into their martyrdom complex - and be seen as nothing more than attacks of the devil. Who is, in their mind, literally a real thing with big red horns.
"I think for so long I had to sit in the church and be subjected to really crazy teachings, and to be yelled at on Sunday and told that I was a terrible person. And then doubting it, and then being told that if I was doubting, it was because my faith wasn’t strong enough, and just being gaslit constantly. If I was doubting, then maybe you weren’t praying enough — there’s always an answer to put you in the wrong."
If this was a woman complaining about her husband doing this, we would all legit tell her she was in an abusive relationship and she should leave as soon as she is able. It breaks my heart that churches (and parents) do this to children.
This comparison is very, very apt.
Cult survivors say the same thing. It’s their fault for not being healed etc
The part where he talks about being born again at 5 years old. That unlocked a core memory for me, followed by a deluge of pieces falling into place.
I was 7 years old when I decided to be baptized. There was more fanfare in my house than any birthday or holiday. My parents invited the youth pastor over to… I don’t know… make sure I was ripe for the picking? Ew.
As a gay kid growing up against the backdrop of AIDS and the Satanic Panic, all I knew to be true was that I didn’t fit in. Anywhere. Even my own family.
So when, suddenly, I had everyone’s undivided attention, I started to understand the rules of the game. I even got my own Bible with an inscription and everything (A hippy, trippy Good News Bible if anyone remembers those)
But as the years went by the cracks started to show. I wasn’t accepted. I was being told to change everything about myself. The God who loved me unconditionally, actually had a lot of conditions. If I didn’t fall in line, I’d be tormented for all eternity. Because… love.
Now I’m 50 years old, re-raising myself while parenting my 5-year-old daughter. It’s been 2+ years of weekly therapy appointments. I’ve done Cognitive Behavioral Therapy. I’ve dug up so many old, forgotten wounds in an effort to heal them. The self-talk never ends. It’s constant. Always reminding myself that it’s ok for me to take up space on this planet.
Thank you for posting this, David. ❤️ My neurons are firing all over the place. Thank puppies that Christian Nightmares exists.
Hey Jay - I know this can be a lot. So while I am glad this unlocked some stuff, also just take care because these memories flooding back can be a *trip*. It sounds from what you say you are taking care, and have done the work - but yeah, isn't it fucking mad what we forget. And so much of that forgotten stuff *shaped us*.
I just remember it SO vividly now, it's hard to believe I had completely buried it for this long. Definitely trippy. It helps I had already processed my Jesus cookies, but that's another story for another day.
A new lil' crumb! Yummy!
Mmmmmmm, jesus cookies...
You and me both. It’s astounding how many people have stories with similar threads to my own. I vividly remember getting baptised at age ten purely because my older brother did, and how much I craved the attention he received.
Similar to you, I grew up in the 90s in the shadow of the AIDs pandemic and the Grim Reaper - bowling ad campaign here in Australia (Google that shit, it’s awful). So being indoctrinated in and out of the church with a message that said basically all gays get AIDS and die, it’s not hard to imagine how terrified and full of self loathing I was when I worked out I was gay.
Like a lot of us, I’ve spent thousands on therapy to unwork all of this. I felt like sending the bill to c3 in exchange for the unknown amount I gave in tithing to an organisation that was slowly destroying me.
The indoctrination is insidious. The biggest hurdle in healing from those wounds is admitting it was abusive in the first place. But of course if I call Christianity a cult at family functions it doesn't go over well. 🤷♂️
Hahah. Yep.
It’s a hard one because I don’t see any issues with Christianity as a faith (if Christian’s actually read their bibles) it’s the church at large I have issues with, and I’m pretty sure Jesus would too based on his teachings.
I sent them an email:
Hello,
I just wanted to query the appointment of Brent Cameron considering the independent report interviewing hundreds of interns about his behaviour and the frankly horrific abuse.
Will he be supervised around young staff?
Kind regards,
Timothy
I've mentioned before that I've grown up Christian and still am. I've completed a Youth Ministry Internship, I've led in youth ministries, and I've been involved in various Churches. I've always had a problem with a lot of what Church culture is. So much judgement, maintaining appearances etc. I cant stand pentecostal prosperity faithluencing (my word) weird stuff. Don't get me started on tele-evangelism. My faith at least is not in weird preachers or people, and despite all the unanswered questions I still choose to believe. The type of Church i appreciate are the ones running support services for people struggling with addiction, trying to get out of debt, thiose suffering violence and abuse, those without homes. That's the kind of Church i can get behind. The rest of this crap makes me sick and/or cringe...or both
Thanks for being one of the good 'uns, Caleb!
It's been my observation, as someone who grew up as a complete heathen, that religion is a human construct that acts as an organising principle, an amplifier for the human that already exists.
So you get churches that amplify fear and anxiety in their people, and you get the ones that amplify the Cameron bro's avaricious, authoritarian streak.
But you also get the ones that amplify the grace and manaaki of their members, and that's a beautiful thing.
I recently came out as bisexual as in a month ago. I also work for a church and will keep their name anonymous just due to their policies of social media. When I came out to them, they embraced me with loving arms and welcomed me into living in my truth. It’s been an amazing experience.
With that being said, I agree with the gaslit statement for a lot of churches. It’s not about the good you do, but about the wrong that has yet to be committed. Hell, you’re fucked at birth in their eyes because you’re born a sinner despite being not able to walk, talk, crawl, chew solid food, or have a conscience thought. This is their belief. It’s the ultimate guilt trip into keeping you coming back so they can not only take your hard earned money, but indoctrinate you into their core values so they have voter and influence in the community and nation. It’s beyond disturbing. But there is a reason their numbers in these places of worship are dwindling. Not all churches are losing people, but a good deal are losing members. People are tired of being guilt tripped. Though sadly this shit will still exist for quite sometime. Maybe indefinitely or until the collapse of human civilization.
ADAM!
Congrats to you!
Congrats to your church for not being accepting and proving that not Christian churches are a hellscape!
I appreciate it. I owe coming out partly due to you. But I didn’t say to that make it sound like church is wonderful or to promote me. It’s more about how churches refuse to evolve as well as letting go of prejudices and bias that they use to control others and bring hatred to human kind. I recognize how fortunate I am, but it’s not like that for millions of others. I heard it said in an AA group that we grow resentful of the God of our ancestors which is this very hateful figure.
How can their Christian teachings promote a God of hatred and prejudice? Jesus was an immigrant and if humans were created in Gods images, wouldn’t being a person of color, a different nationality or a sexual orientation be ok as it reflects the creator? These people are assholes and I appreciate how you call them on it.
I think people like that are only religous because it indulges their desire to feel superior with very little actual work. Being open and accepting, turning the other cheek, giving to the poor. Stuff like that involves humility and introspection, and isn't as inherently appealing as "God hates all the same people you do, and he wants you to live in a mansion and drive a nice car."
(And congrats!)
... and/or ride a Harley Davidson and wear gold chains.
Glad that you feel comfortable in your surroundings and that you have the support from people who should be there to love and support - not judge - not only their fellow parishioners but also the rest of the community writ large. From your previous posts (and restaurant recommendations, of which I've done a few) we're in the same state and what that environment can be like, especially in more rural areas. I didn't realize it until later, but I was in a much more open, accepting, and supportive denomination growing up (even at the mountain retreat down the highway in H'ville) and I can only wish that to be the environment others could have experienced. Learning about this entirely opposite side of the religious spectrum that I thought was the unusual and rare has really been eye-opening to me. I've had many LGBT+ friends who've been shunned by their churches or hidden themselves while working there, but also seen plenty who have found congregations that embrace and love them and where they find a place where they belong and can thrive.
This brings to mind Hayden's article about all the similarities between Trump and the Antichrist. It's less literally true, and more people haven't really changed that much in the past two millienia. It's not prophecy, just human nature.
I don't have much religous baggage, but I was very sick as a child, and if you'd ask me a couple years ago what impact it still had on me as an adult, I probably would've brushed it off. But as I've dealt with some less serious health issues lately, all of it has started bubbling back up again. And as I've been unpacking it more, so much of the way I think and act, things I don't like about myself, seems to have its roots in my childhood.
I guess what I'm really saying is we could all use a lot more therapy. Except the Camerons, I have a feeling it woud just make them worse. Fuck those guys.
Hayden's piece for anyone who missed it!
https://www.webworm.co/p/antichrist
"I spent most of my early 20s whining about how God doesn’t exist. The faith I’d held was crumbling, and being replaced in my mind by a huge deposit of angst. I made whole albums bemoaning the newly empty sky; the sudden void where heaven, hope, and meaning used to be. “Wah wah wah,” I moaned. “You only get one call but there’s no telephone.”
It’s been 15 years since then, and I’m pleased to admit in light of recent events, I may have overreacted. The Bible I once nitpicked over its stances on shellfish and whether it’s okay to have kids eaten by bears if they hassle you for being bald is making a huge comeback. It may not be perfect on the issue of killing every firstborn son in Egypt but it’s hard to get mad when its ancient texts are laying out our current situation with an accuracy so eerie it would make Nostradamus shart in jealousy. I’m talking, of course, about how Donald Trump is clearly, irrefutably the Antichrist as described in the prophetic Biblical books of Daniel and Revelation."
etc
I've been tithing Hayden 10% of my monthly income ever since, and I'm happy to report I've only been smoten once.
Always pleased you are doing this. Two days ago, I thought I was strong enough to finally start the redress journey, since the dam awful NZ government has made us survivors have to do it for ourselves, again. It feels like the royal commission into abuse in state and faith-based care was a failure. I have two cases, one with the Salvation Army, which terrifies me as I don't believe they will say sorry, and the other with the Ministry of Health. I phoned the MoH and was told the man who does the historical claims is away on holiday. So, after everything the government said and all the millions they poured into the Ministries to make the process easier for us survivors, we have just found out that it is yet another lie by this government. I wrote my email and included huge amounts of records showing abuse, hit send, and now knowing only one man will look at it, god knows when his holiday ends or what his backlog is like? I am too scared of the Salvation Army, and knowing people like what you wrote above, I feel deflated. Two days later, I feel like evil always wins, the cesspit always rises to the top. I am going to go and watch some daft animals on TikTok, it's the only thing keeping me laughing.
Don't give up, Jazmine. And watch daft tiktok animals as much as you like, when you like.
Thank you.
To me this encapsulates the entirety of organised religion:
“And then doubting it, and then being told that if I was doubting, it was because my faith wasn’t strong enough, and just being gaslit constantly. If I was doubting, then maybe you weren’t praying enough — there’s always an answer to put you in the wrong.”
Gaslighting has been the foundation of organised religion since the beginning
So much gaslighting! As a teen, I asked genuine questions. Instead of answers, I endured the laying on of hands to cast out the demons of doubt. Then those demons of doubt seemed to be multiplying and had to be cast out regularly at services. I was also infected by the demons of vegetarianism, and ... astrology, after I pointed out some constellations at a youth camp. Anything they didn't like/ understand is a freakin'demon! ( I left !)
I really enjoyed reading your interview with the Christian Nightmares guy, David. I feel for anyone raised in a fundamentalist household. I’ve been reflecting on Brent Cameron’s appt with Kingdom Hope Church. I’m a Christian and a pastor and a big part of our message is about forgiveness and second chances. But I believe that message gets confused with a person being restored to active pastoral ministry. When someone has been found guilty of ongoing abuse, that should disqualify them from ministry. Of course they can/should be restored to a church community but it’s not appropriate for them to once again assume the role of pastor.
Totally. I also think there's the thing with Brent and John where they never actually apologised, or said they were at fault.
It was all blame shifting - and at times, actively pushing back against those who came forward (and leaving the likes of Charlotte Cummings with $20k in bills to pay: https://www.webworm.co/p/charlottelegalfees)
Just the craziest stuff.
That’s very true, David. A dear friend is a Jewish theologian and he speaks about the concept of T’Shuva in Judaism. The Christian equivalent is repentance. It involves five steps:
1. Acknowledging that I’ve done the wrong thing.
2. Expressing remorse.
3. Seeking forgiveness which is often an ongoing process that can’t be rushed. And it’s about the person who’s been wronged - not about making ME feel better.
4. Taking steps to rectify the wrongdoing if possible.
5. Avoid repeating the behaviour.
Clearly the Camerons have dodged sme of these. Only time will tell if the behaviour is repeated and others are abused. Sadly, that’s often been the case in the Christian church.
*
I totally hear you about terrible shit coming back around once again, particularly in Christian circles. I had that same feeling when a post about Michael Tait (ex DC Talk of the 1990s) being accused of sexual assault popped into my Facebook feed last month. It's like once again, someone with a hugely public profile in Christian circles has been revealed to be a dodgy bawbag. What the fuck is wrong with evangelical Christianity, particularly the hyped-up mega-church that gave the world the Christian music scene and tele-evangelists. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/jun/13/michael-tait-sexual-assault-allegations
That was a crazy thing to see unfold. Michael Tait essentially said, "Yes, I did that stuff" in an instagram post. Newsboys tour on, not saying a lot. And their management - so gross. Nashville is a strange, closeted town.
Learning about gentle Jesus and watching the nuns lay into my fellow pupils with a strap kind of put me off believing anything they said about heaven and hell.
I started questioning my religion (Lutheran) around age 14. Especially when it came to LGBTQ+ issues and abortion. Probably why I majored in Religious Studies. 🤣
I went back to religion a bit after my dad died as it made me feel closer to him. But after a while I started to snap out of my depression and realized that lifestyle and faith is 100% NOT ME. I do believe in something. Like a higher energy but the Christian God? Nope.
I also don’t want to teach all of that to my children. Being taught to fear God’s wrath and worried you will burn in hell for “sins” is fucking brutal and heavy to impose on young minds. I have a children’s book on World Religions, if my they are ever interested. I will never stop them from wanting to learn and explore it. To me faith is personal and should be discovered on your own.
I love the Christian Nightmares account. Reading this was great! Another one I follow on IG is Eve Was Framed. Her name is Promise and she is the daughter of a preacher turned Athiest. It’s appalling to see the comments she receives from so called loving Christians. She gets labelled a Jezebel, a whore, and many other insults, but has great rebuttals and insights due to her upbringing.
But…this is a religion I believe we all could get behind:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DLxAi57vPLn/?igsh=bDEzemo0Yjh1MDAy
Childhood wounds are so very hard to heal and put behind us, even if they are from supposed ‘good’ places like church*shudder* Sending love to all that have been hurt
None of the 'churches' that are taking on the Camerons, either as pastors or speakers, are the least bit concerned about their backgrounds because they fit like a glove into their own practices - they're all doing it too.
Absolutely.
And any of the "negative press" (ie saying out loud what they've been doing) will just feed into their martyrdom complex - and be seen as nothing more than attacks of the devil. Who is, in their mind, literally a real thing with big red horns.
Well, I’m selfishly grateful that these two hypothetical pricks are no longer in my country. The Aussies can keep them.