Jun 21, 2022·edited Jun 21, 2022Liked by David Farrier
Ok. Simple. If you want your child to go to a school that will bring it up to be a bigot, then you pick up the bill. Let us, in a secular country, stop funding these religious schools. Most religions have access to plenty of funds of their own, anyway!
Famous Christian Theologian and Narnia author, C.S Lewis wrote that "Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive" in one of his nerdy hard to comprehend books.
There is a common concept that much evil is done with good intentions (which is sometimes misused to defend/explain psychopaths, dictators, mass murderers).
God of the Machine author and sacred cow satirist Isabel Paterson wrote that, "Most of the harm in the world is done by good people, and not by accident, lapse, or omission. It is the result of their deliberate actions, long persevered in, which they hold to be motivated by high ideals toward virtuous ends".
They're both talking, I believe, about situations like this. Add in that newer concept of cognitive dissonance, and you've got this situation where "Christians" are blinded to their oppressive habits and can only interpret corrective actions towards them as persecution. It's the same thing that makes people with react defensively to the concept of white privilege, the same thing that makes dictators think they're acting for the greater good. It's born in ignorance and nourished in echo-chambers of like-minded agreement. People believe that they are good, and therefore all their actions are good. They've got no idea of nuance.
I think you are being way to generous to the leaders and believing it’s in the greater good.
Nadene is closer to what is going on. Narcissistic people are often in these positions and they need them to get what is known as narcissistic supply. They need the energy and adoration of people/partners to survive. They are not going to give up, back down while this is happening. They will attempt to gaslight their way out of it or have to find another source. The church is a wonderful hunting ground.
Tim, you sound like the decent good guy who believes the best in people and therefore way closer to the teachings of Christ than the arseholes that demand adherence to principles that demean others.
I wasn't trying to be generous. Narcissistic supply is an interesting thing, perhaps way more applicable to leaders of big churches, maybe... I'm going to go read about it.
There aren't too many teachers I know who get into teaching in order to gain energy and adoration. I see it is a fairly taxing and servant oriented profession. But I know the position is still one of power and influence so the potential for harm is huge, particularly given a self-righteous and abusive framework. Akin to teachers who believed they were doing the best thing for pasifika and māori students by crushing their culture and language and assimilating them into a European one.
Unfortunately "we believe" and "we think" do not equate to "we are" when it comes to meeting mandated principles and requirements under law.
Pretending that the issues to be addressed are the schools preference for prioritizing enrollments from students of a Christian background and a couple of random complaints is quite an odd response too. The issue is line item 13 on the "parents sign here" form. The line you added after approval from the ministry of education for the other 12 things and the statement that contradicts the legal obligations of your school to not discriminate. If you want to write some sanctimonious dross, at least keep it on topic
Yeah - they are entirely sidestepping the issue. Careful language (but clumsy as hell) in their letter. It's a combination of wildly entertaining AND frustrating to read.
Great stuff David. I wonder if you are understating the government funding to BC and other state integrated schools. Beside a quarterly payment, the big one is that the state pays (directly, not via the school) ALL TEACHER SALARIES including the principal and senior professional staff. Another area is that the state pays for school buses to take students past other state schools to schools of “special character”.
Thank you David. I love that you are on their wall as Head Boy. That the school ignores you (because you're ALSO a journalist) make a complete lie of their final paragraph in their letter. They seem to want to cherry-pick who they think is worthy of being replied to. Please keep this brilliant work up- for everyone's sakes. I know this must become emotionally and professionally draining. Your reading community of subscribers is with you.
Having spent the last 18 months in intense therapy learning what gaslighting is... yeah that letter is just a perfect example.
Therapy also helped me finally work out my values and how to live by them. For me, it's integrity and compassion, so when I look at a letter like that, I see what purports to be both... except as my narcissist ex taught me so well, actions shout louder than words.
I thought there was a bible passage on this and I just found it:
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
How can that be in their bible and yet not be adhered to? And especially to vulnerable children?
They cherry pick the Bible. They also reckon Satan does it, too? Hard to tell one from t'other really, except that no-one could accuse Satan of hypocrisy 😉
I guess nobody at Bethlehem College has worked out that “Christian special character” might include - being open to being wrong when a whole bunch of people say you’ve hurt them.
To the parents and prospective parents…some food for thought
Can I start by saying that I am not a parent of a past or present student at Bethlehem College but I have seen a close family member go through the decision to send their children to a ‘special character’ integrated school.
In that case the decision on what school to send their children was made on a number of factors including; proximity/access, child’s preference and where their friends were going, educational reputation, personal connections with staff, money, alumni… and Christian values.
I also get that by the time many parents get the documentation to sign, the decision has been made, people told, other options declined, uniforms bought…essentially it is too late. For this couple, (and many of their friends) Christian values is about education with a moral compass, giving the children the opportunity to establish their own values and doing so in a (hopefully) more caring environment. Having read the Bethlehem College statement of beliefs, I can appreciate that many parents thought ‘what a lot of gobbledegook’, started to glaze over and just signed it to get it done. In my example, one parent was way less ‘on-board’ than the other anyway and so the one that signed the documents was on their own.
What I’m getting at with this long introduction is that in my experience not all parents are as ‘hard-core’ in their Christian beliefs as the board is promulgating.
Actions like the ‘kill the gays’ fiasco was probably exactly what they were hoping to keep their children away from.
I can imagine that quite a few Bethlehem College parents are now in the position of realising that the values and inclusion they thought they were getting (and paying for) are far from caring…or even honest.
You love your child(ren) and you want the best for them. But you also know that EVEN IF your child is heterosexual with no specific gender issues, there is likely to be a time during their schooling when they clash with one or other school policy and you are called in, or go in, to support your child. The communication that David has published has given you a strong clue into how you will be treated. It is patronising, passive-aggressive and has no problem with quoting scripture at you or blatantly lying. This is the leadership you are paying for, and these are the values that are seeping through the school.
I know it is a huge call to move your child once they are mid-schooling, but if you could reach out to other parents and supportive staff then maybe with numbers, you can get some meaningful change in the leadership, documentation and style of the school.
Perhaps taking a stand like that is closer to the leadership and role modelling you were hoping to expose your child to?
I have recently gone through the decision of choosing a school for my child. An option floated was a Catholic school nearby, which was smaller and someone suggested might be better suited due to suspected ADHD. I said I didn't want my child at a religious school. The response was "Oh, they're not that religious." Are you kidding me!? They're Catholic!!
I've already been stung by putting my child into Kindercare, which I didn't realise was founded by The Latter Day Saints or Seventh Day Adventists (can't remember which right now). They've been far more overt in their beliefs than I had come to expect, as they hide their origins.
I think this is a good development. They've drawn a line in the sand, but not understood the water level is rising. It doesn't bode well for the school management.
I find it interesting that they can’t have missed all the Arise stuff and yet still respond in the same way. You would think someone might have seen their example and chosen not to make similar mistakes.
They are all kinda... arrogant. I think that feeling of having the truth (unlike the rest of us dummies) really mashes their brains into this really arrogant place. It's remarkable.
So they will embrace openly and lovingly in conversation with any ex students who are hurt, but they won’t talk to you at all. They also won’t talk to you as an NZ journalist because they’re only speaking to NZ journalists. And they’re all about love and kindness and treating thy neighbor as they’d treat themselves, but they’re refusing to stop driving certain kids to suicide attempts even when legally forced to do so. Ok got it.
No surprise here. In the Worldview of Bethlehem there is no place for anyone of the LGBQTI (I hate acronyms so I will in future refer to the rainbow community) inside the church. To keep informed of the world of fundamentalism I am subscribed to the Christian Post, a mouthpiece of the Southern Baptists. The number one issues appear to be 1) Transgender, 2) Gays and Lesbians 3) So called grooming by gays and lesbians to convert children to be gay or lesbian, 4) Critical Race Theory which argues there is systemic bias in the legal institutions against people of colour. All of these are tied together under the banner of "Wokism".
Nothing is mentioned about the poor, the marginalized, the stranger, the orphan and widow. That is nothing about the people Jesus was concerned about or in the book of James who said pure religion is to visit the widows and orphans in their distress. But then I think I would be considered by the leaders of Bethlehem or the SBC to be a CINO (Christian in Name Only) for I consider these to be more important than issues about the Rainbow Community.
It is a wonderful reminder of where I have come from and why I never want to go back. My transition is complete from rabid world hater to a wokish CINO. I don't plan writing to BC about the inconsistent treatment of marriage in the Bible as it will be rejected out of hand. Polygamy and concubinage were based on the patriarchal worldview of the culture of that time was accepted without question. And so is BC view of marriage, even if they reject polygamy, for it assumes the superiority of males as intrinsic to the created order and part of God's plan.
They are in breach of their funding agreement, so turn the money tap off. That should bring them to heel so they at least pay lip service. But it won't fundamentally change anything because these people hate "the gays" or anyone different - including, apparently, their ex-Head Boy. Shut it down. Shut them all down. "Special Character" my arse.
I'd agree there! The M of E should by now have mandated the wearing of masks in schools, due to the number of teachers and students becoming infected. It mandates hats, to prevent sunburn, but not one effective method of preventing the spread of Covid.
The Teachers Council, I can only assume by their speed, is one very overworked part time employee. I'm still waiting on an outcome for an incident that happened in July 2020. The Ministry of Education has no such excuse, they hold the budget and therefore the power.
If you are actively discriminating against an individual or group because of your "Christian Beliefs," then you are doing this wrong. This is insane; it is NOT what Jesus would do. Question: if the government pays the teachers and staff directly, couldn't it just stop if BC continues with this discrimination? #Churchtoo
Hi David. I am a Pentecostal pastor from Melbourne, Australia, and have been interested in your writings about Arise Church. I also enjoyed your recent interview with Pete and Jared on The Bible for Normal People podcast.
I am just as horrified as you are about systemic abuse within churches. It's been happening for years, and it needs to be exposed.
I agree with your statement, "They claim they are under spiritual attack, centring themselves as the victim." It's a popular narrative amongst some conservative Christians who view themselves as conspirators on this planet. I know because I was just like that when I converted to Christianity in my late teens/early 20s. The book of Revelation was read accompanied by the daily newspaper. The antichrist was about to be revealed, the great tribulation would start when the planets aligned (March 1982), and Jesus would return in 1988. Nothing happened that time or since, and I eventually realised this narrative was utterly wrong and is not an accurate understanding of the Bible.
I was amazed to watch some evangelical and pentecostal Christians again go down the conspiratorial rabbit hole through the pandemic. I realised nothing had changed for people who hold to this view of the Bible. It appears they had learned nothing from history.
The other popular narrative is, "Yeah, sure people have been hurt but look at all the good things we do." Souls are saved etc. I believe it is essential that Christian leaders are careful not to minimise the hurt and abuse experienced by others on our watch. Neither must we play the victim. The Christian virtues of truth, honesty, and justice must shine through.
Ok. Simple. If you want your child to go to a school that will bring it up to be a bigot, then you pick up the bill. Let us, in a secular country, stop funding these religious schools. Most religions have access to plenty of funds of their own, anyway!
100%.
Famous Christian Theologian and Narnia author, C.S Lewis wrote that "Of all tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive" in one of his nerdy hard to comprehend books.
There is a common concept that much evil is done with good intentions (which is sometimes misused to defend/explain psychopaths, dictators, mass murderers).
God of the Machine author and sacred cow satirist Isabel Paterson wrote that, "Most of the harm in the world is done by good people, and not by accident, lapse, or omission. It is the result of their deliberate actions, long persevered in, which they hold to be motivated by high ideals toward virtuous ends".
They're both talking, I believe, about situations like this. Add in that newer concept of cognitive dissonance, and you've got this situation where "Christians" are blinded to their oppressive habits and can only interpret corrective actions towards them as persecution. It's the same thing that makes people with react defensively to the concept of white privilege, the same thing that makes dictators think they're acting for the greater good. It's born in ignorance and nourished in echo-chambers of like-minded agreement. People believe that they are good, and therefore all their actions are good. They've got no idea of nuance.
I think you are being way to generous to the leaders and believing it’s in the greater good.
Nadene is closer to what is going on. Narcissistic people are often in these positions and they need them to get what is known as narcissistic supply. They need the energy and adoration of people/partners to survive. They are not going to give up, back down while this is happening. They will attempt to gaslight their way out of it or have to find another source. The church is a wonderful hunting ground.
Tim, you sound like the decent good guy who believes the best in people and therefore way closer to the teachings of Christ than the arseholes that demand adherence to principles that demean others.
I wasn't trying to be generous. Narcissistic supply is an interesting thing, perhaps way more applicable to leaders of big churches, maybe... I'm going to go read about it.
There aren't too many teachers I know who get into teaching in order to gain energy and adoration. I see it is a fairly taxing and servant oriented profession. But I know the position is still one of power and influence so the potential for harm is huge, particularly given a self-righteous and abusive framework. Akin to teachers who believed they were doing the best thing for pasifika and māori students by crushing their culture and language and assimilating them into a European one.
Brilliant Tim a great summary of what’s going on
fantastic insight, thank you
Unfortunately "we believe" and "we think" do not equate to "we are" when it comes to meeting mandated principles and requirements under law.
Pretending that the issues to be addressed are the schools preference for prioritizing enrollments from students of a Christian background and a couple of random complaints is quite an odd response too. The issue is line item 13 on the "parents sign here" form. The line you added after approval from the ministry of education for the other 12 things and the statement that contradicts the legal obligations of your school to not discriminate. If you want to write some sanctimonious dross, at least keep it on topic
Yeah - they are entirely sidestepping the issue. Careful language (but clumsy as hell) in their letter. It's a combination of wildly entertaining AND frustrating to read.
Great stuff David. I wonder if you are understating the government funding to BC and other state integrated schools. Beside a quarterly payment, the big one is that the state pays (directly, not via the school) ALL TEACHER SALARIES including the principal and senior professional staff. Another area is that the state pays for school buses to take students past other state schools to schools of “special character”.
I did not know this. Thank you for the clarity.
Thank you David. I love that you are on their wall as Head Boy. That the school ignores you (because you're ALSO a journalist) make a complete lie of their final paragraph in their letter. They seem to want to cherry-pick who they think is worthy of being replied to. Please keep this brilliant work up- for everyone's sakes. I know this must become emotionally and professionally draining. Your reading community of subscribers is with you.
Yeah, they are - to put it bluntly - full of shit.
I'm so glad your name is on their wall, David.
Having spent the last 18 months in intense therapy learning what gaslighting is... yeah that letter is just a perfect example.
Therapy also helped me finally work out my values and how to live by them. For me, it's integrity and compassion, so when I look at a letter like that, I see what purports to be both... except as my narcissist ex taught me so well, actions shout louder than words.
I thought there was a bible passage on this and I just found it:
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
How can that be in their bible and yet not be adhered to? And especially to vulnerable children?
Really glad you've found therapy useful. Me too. It takes time. Years, sometimes.
And yes - once you see gaslighting, you can't unsee it. It's everywhere. And certainly all through BC and Arise. Birds of a feather.
And control also. Because this is all about control. Once you see the depths of patriarchy and its control, you can't unsee that either.
They cherry pick the Bible. They also reckon Satan does it, too? Hard to tell one from t'other really, except that no-one could accuse Satan of hypocrisy 😉
Oh Nadene they aren't 'judging'...they are loving...and living their beliefs...only God judges remember :/.
Ah yes, of course! Poor old God.
I guess nobody at Bethlehem College has worked out that “Christian special character” might include - being open to being wrong when a whole bunch of people say you’ve hurt them.
They're so stuck in their mindset. Exactly how it was at Arise. Instantly going 'THERE IS NOTHING WRONG HERE WE ARE RIGHT YOU ARE WRONG GO AWAY'.
It's just the same old shit. Every time.
To the parents and prospective parents…some food for thought
Can I start by saying that I am not a parent of a past or present student at Bethlehem College but I have seen a close family member go through the decision to send their children to a ‘special character’ integrated school.
In that case the decision on what school to send their children was made on a number of factors including; proximity/access, child’s preference and where their friends were going, educational reputation, personal connections with staff, money, alumni… and Christian values.
I also get that by the time many parents get the documentation to sign, the decision has been made, people told, other options declined, uniforms bought…essentially it is too late. For this couple, (and many of their friends) Christian values is about education with a moral compass, giving the children the opportunity to establish their own values and doing so in a (hopefully) more caring environment. Having read the Bethlehem College statement of beliefs, I can appreciate that many parents thought ‘what a lot of gobbledegook’, started to glaze over and just signed it to get it done. In my example, one parent was way less ‘on-board’ than the other anyway and so the one that signed the documents was on their own.
What I’m getting at with this long introduction is that in my experience not all parents are as ‘hard-core’ in their Christian beliefs as the board is promulgating.
Actions like the ‘kill the gays’ fiasco was probably exactly what they were hoping to keep their children away from.
I can imagine that quite a few Bethlehem College parents are now in the position of realising that the values and inclusion they thought they were getting (and paying for) are far from caring…or even honest.
You love your child(ren) and you want the best for them. But you also know that EVEN IF your child is heterosexual with no specific gender issues, there is likely to be a time during their schooling when they clash with one or other school policy and you are called in, or go in, to support your child. The communication that David has published has given you a strong clue into how you will be treated. It is patronising, passive-aggressive and has no problem with quoting scripture at you or blatantly lying. This is the leadership you are paying for, and these are the values that are seeping through the school.
I know it is a huge call to move your child once they are mid-schooling, but if you could reach out to other parents and supportive staff then maybe with numbers, you can get some meaningful change in the leadership, documentation and style of the school.
Perhaps taking a stand like that is closer to the leadership and role modelling you were hoping to expose your child to?
I have recently gone through the decision of choosing a school for my child. An option floated was a Catholic school nearby, which was smaller and someone suggested might be better suited due to suspected ADHD. I said I didn't want my child at a religious school. The response was "Oh, they're not that religious." Are you kidding me!? They're Catholic!!
I've already been stung by putting my child into Kindercare, which I didn't realise was founded by The Latter Day Saints or Seventh Day Adventists (can't remember which right now). They've been far more overt in their beliefs than I had come to expect, as they hide their origins.
It's definitely been a lesson...
Chris - YES to all this. I am going to include this in my next newsletter. It rings so, so true. Thank you for taking the time to write that down.
I think this is a good development. They've drawn a line in the sand, but not understood the water level is rising. It doesn't bode well for the school management.
I find it interesting that they can’t have missed all the Arise stuff and yet still respond in the same way. You would think someone might have seen their example and chosen not to make similar mistakes.
They are all kinda... arrogant. I think that feeling of having the truth (unlike the rest of us dummies) really mashes their brains into this really arrogant place. It's remarkable.
So they will embrace openly and lovingly in conversation with any ex students who are hurt, but they won’t talk to you at all. They also won’t talk to you as an NZ journalist because they’re only speaking to NZ journalists. And they’re all about love and kindness and treating thy neighbor as they’d treat themselves, but they’re refusing to stop driving certain kids to suicide attempts even when legally forced to do so. Ok got it.
Oh Dan it's so nice to see you in here, buddy.
What you said pretty much nails it. It's pretty weird, right? Cooked.
No surprise here. In the Worldview of Bethlehem there is no place for anyone of the LGBQTI (I hate acronyms so I will in future refer to the rainbow community) inside the church. To keep informed of the world of fundamentalism I am subscribed to the Christian Post, a mouthpiece of the Southern Baptists. The number one issues appear to be 1) Transgender, 2) Gays and Lesbians 3) So called grooming by gays and lesbians to convert children to be gay or lesbian, 4) Critical Race Theory which argues there is systemic bias in the legal institutions against people of colour. All of these are tied together under the banner of "Wokism".
Nothing is mentioned about the poor, the marginalized, the stranger, the orphan and widow. That is nothing about the people Jesus was concerned about or in the book of James who said pure religion is to visit the widows and orphans in their distress. But then I think I would be considered by the leaders of Bethlehem or the SBC to be a CINO (Christian in Name Only) for I consider these to be more important than issues about the Rainbow Community.
You have a VERY strong stomach to subscribe to the Christian Post! Respect. I don't think I could do it.
It is a wonderful reminder of where I have come from and why I never want to go back. My transition is complete from rabid world hater to a wokish CINO. I don't plan writing to BC about the inconsistent treatment of marriage in the Bible as it will be rejected out of hand. Polygamy and concubinage were based on the patriarchal worldview of the culture of that time was accepted without question. And so is BC view of marriage, even if they reject polygamy, for it assumes the superiority of males as intrinsic to the created order and part of God's plan.
Mainstream religion vs cults… it can be a very fine line
Hard agree. Under his eye.
Blessed Be the Fruitloops.
They are in breach of their funding agreement, so turn the money tap off. That should bring them to heel so they at least pay lip service. But it won't fundamentally change anything because these people hate "the gays" or anyone different - including, apparently, their ex-Head Boy. Shut it down. Shut them all down. "Special Character" my arse.
The Ministry of Education appears to move like a sloth. Teachers Council very slow / unclear also. Curious how this plays out.
I'd agree there! The M of E should by now have mandated the wearing of masks in schools, due to the number of teachers and students becoming infected. It mandates hats, to prevent sunburn, but not one effective method of preventing the spread of Covid.
Weird. Not fair to sloths, though.
The Teachers Council, I can only assume by their speed, is one very overworked part time employee. I'm still waiting on an outcome for an incident that happened in July 2020. The Ministry of Education has no such excuse, they hold the budget and therefore the power.
It doesn’t matter what they “believe”, they still have an obligation as outlined in their funding? The gaslighting is intense but so painfully obvious
EXACTLY.
Go do this shit - and don't get taxpayer money. Fair.
If you are actively discriminating against an individual or group because of your "Christian Beliefs," then you are doing this wrong. This is insane; it is NOT what Jesus would do. Question: if the government pays the teachers and staff directly, couldn't it just stop if BC continues with this discrimination? #Churchtoo
Hi David. I am a Pentecostal pastor from Melbourne, Australia, and have been interested in your writings about Arise Church. I also enjoyed your recent interview with Pete and Jared on The Bible for Normal People podcast.
I am just as horrified as you are about systemic abuse within churches. It's been happening for years, and it needs to be exposed.
I agree with your statement, "They claim they are under spiritual attack, centring themselves as the victim." It's a popular narrative amongst some conservative Christians who view themselves as conspirators on this planet. I know because I was just like that when I converted to Christianity in my late teens/early 20s. The book of Revelation was read accompanied by the daily newspaper. The antichrist was about to be revealed, the great tribulation would start when the planets aligned (March 1982), and Jesus would return in 1988. Nothing happened that time or since, and I eventually realised this narrative was utterly wrong and is not an accurate understanding of the Bible.
I was amazed to watch some evangelical and pentecostal Christians again go down the conspiratorial rabbit hole through the pandemic. I realised nothing had changed for people who hold to this view of the Bible. It appears they had learned nothing from history.
The other popular narrative is, "Yeah, sure people have been hurt but look at all the good things we do." Souls are saved etc. I believe it is essential that Christian leaders are careful not to minimise the hurt and abuse experienced by others on our watch. Neither must we play the victim. The Christian virtues of truth, honesty, and justice must shine through.