I’m happy to comment on physical appearance when it’s a choice - the amount of ugly eyewear on these blokes is too damn high. Imagine thinking Lorde sucks but these glasses are mint.
Lorde’s first album came out the fall I moved out for the first time and went to college and it kind of feels like we’ve grown up together, her and I. Her music always speaks to me so much and I always go back and listen to Pure Heroine when I need to be reminded of that feeling of freedom and sense of self I had when I was 18 and had such optimism in my future. I can’t wait for her new music.
Fuck these dudes for real. It’s no wonder she needs years of reclusiveness between album releases.
You're right to call out New Zealand's men on this, but, and I'm sure most of us here know this, this is a worldwide issue. Comments like your examples are just the price female-presenting (or really, any non-white male presenting) people have to pay for existing publicly on the internet. And god forbid you're a fat human, or you're displaying any sign of sexuality or sensuality where men can see it. It's fucked. The internet can be and has been a great unifying and empowering force for humanity in a lot of ways, but it's also made it so easy for people to say horrible shit like this from behind a veil of relative anonymity and without repercussions.
Anyway, Lorde's new single is a bop and every time a man says something mean about her my love for her and her music increase tenfold. I hope she's ignoring all the hate and thriving.
Amen to this. Definitely a worldwide issue - although in looking at Lorde stuff, New Zealand news websites seem to have more instant awful, and more of the comments. So I think there is this short poppy thing tied into Lorde too, maybe?
I know this is probably one of the most obvious Webworms of all time - no revelations - but I do just think it can be fun looking at WHO is saying this stuff, and being reminded: "Who gives a shit what these fucking brussell sprouts are saying."
Just because something's obvious doesn't mean it shouldn't be talked about! It is interesting and valuable to take a deeper look at phenomena like this, and to bring it out into the light. I think you've mentioned Lorde being singled out by the short poppy thing before, either here or somewhere else. Maybe being a successful NZ woman means she's getting even more shitty comments from NZ men who can't handle that double whammy.
Also, getting nerdy and putting on my anthropologist hat here (gotta get some use out of that expensive piece of paper I earned lol), the short poppies thing seems like it might have roots in before-the-internet times, when smaller groups of people had to engage in various forms of reciprocity to make sure resources were fairly evenly distributed among the group so everyone could survive. There are lots of ways cultures do that, but an important piece is making sure no individual takes more resources than everyone else, at least not long term. So in our modern times, someone like Lorde becoming successful and having a lot of "resources" (wealth, fame, access to food and goods, etc) flowing to her, might set off that deep ingrained urge in people to redistribute those resources more evenly among everyone. Not that that validates shitty comments from these fucking brussell sprouts, but could be a partial explanation for why the short poppy thing is a thing.
Really has interesting implications for our current situation in the US, with just a few brussell sprouts hoarding all the fucking resources. Seems to me there are much better targets available for cutting down than someone like Lorde who's just trying to make good music and earn a living.
That's a really interesting anthropological perspective. I wish people had the same naturally ingrained urge to cut down the white male billionaires currently holding all the power and resources. But apparently we like voting for them instead 🤷♀️
Yeah, well unfortunately humans can also be gullible and dumb... And the people who have all the money and power deliberately take advantage of that and convince us plebs that they have our best interests in mind so we'll vote for them (I'm using the royal we btw) and give them even more money and power as long as we can remain moderately comfortable. The tide will change eventually, and I think we're starting to see that, but who knows if there will be enough of a backlash to bring any meaningful redistribution of power and resources.
Please keep in mind, I only have a BA in anthropology and I'm just musing here about possible links. I'm really more of a recreational anthropologist, definitely not an expert 😅 I do wonder if there are studies that address the short poppy syndrome though. Maybe I'll see if I can dig up some papers.
Like Amy somewhere else on this thread, I too, made an account so I can comment this! I'm immediately overwhelmed by new (to me) platforms so sorry if I if these points have been made, so fair my brain has been able to process "Amy" (hi Amy!), and "short poppies." --- But yes, I think the short poppies (tall poppies?) thing is definitely tied to it, and it's exacerbated by their misogyny. The older I get, the more I realize so many cishet white mens' biggest concern is often "leaving their legacy" or "making their mark" in some way, (while the rest of us are concerned with like, surviving, to varying degrees) and these douchenozzles have been telling themselves their whole lives that the only reason they haven't probably even TRIED to become international superstars is that New Zealand holds them back or whatever. So now a young woman goes and makes a HUGE fn hit and builds an international career so they can't handle someone who is supposed to be inferior (or, if they consider themselves progressive, someone who has had more obstacles than them) find traditional success/recognition. So they freak and PUNCH straight down. I also can't help but notice a lot of these guys are middle-aged-ish. I once read that this age demographic is the first time these men are experiencing a loss of power. And posting abusive bullshit about women and minorities online gives them that rush of power again, they subconsciously are resetting the balance, as they see it.
this reminds me of an much more minor incident I was involved in about 10 years ago. at the time I was still a fashion photographer and had just started a non profit aimed at promoting inclusivity (of all ages, races, sizes, abilities, genders, etc) in the fashion sphere. I was part of a panel talk at Refinery29 on the changing state of gender in fashion (you can read about it here if you want for some reason https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/6-takeaways-from-the-changing-state-of-gender-in-127637323263.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall) and the comments across all platforms were BRUTAL from men. Mostly, I think, because they were mad that none of us were interested in them and somehow we all remained successful. I recall one especially lovely commenter (white male of course) who suggested that I should have been aborted - because I have... short hair? ok. It was WILD. What is wrong with straight, white men? Like, for real? Why were they even reading these articles??? Bizarre.
um of course I want to read about that... also dying that in the pic at that link you're just casually standing next to Jenny Shimizu (and a lot of other very cool people, but as a bi "girl" who grew up in the 90s, Jenny makes me swoon lol). anyway, crazy that women and queer people can thrive without keeping a man front and center in their thoughts, that must be so hard for them.
Jenny is a model agent so I worked with her all the time! Everyone on the panel was cool with the exception of one person who was very annoying but it was a panel full of humans so that's normal. PS men were also very mad they couldn't attend the talk which was like for women by women sigh.
I remember when some dude posted a photo of Lorde and her boyfriend (Asian) as a "whatdoy'allthinkofthis" and she responded with "what's your point?"
Honestly, some people are so toxic. How do they manage to live without poisoning the atmosphere and all around them? (Answer: they poison everything they touch, but some of us are impervious).
Of course there’s one who circled back to Jacinda. Every comment section on e-v-e-r-y topic is gross dudes who look like this ranting about Jacinda. It’s been fucking years.
I see the AOC hate even here from New Zealand - often confusingly on unrelated things. E.g I was reading something about Franz Kafka the other day and the comment section was a guy saying “I bet AOC has never read metamorphosis!” It boggles my mind how obsessed these men are.
Thing is, Lorde is not singing for them, or about them, or recognising their existence in any way. As far as she is concerned, in their muddy camo, blue suits or novelty glasses, they are utterly irrelevant to everything she is.
That really gets their collective goat, and I am here for it.
I’d like to see the data cross section of : men feeling entitled to comment on women. Who also are single or abusive. Who like to cosplay army, or show their special skill, or have a close up vanity business shot on social media. Who also have a supercalifragilistic ego. Sorry, my bad. We’ve already got that, thanks David!
I have never commented on WW before but this has enraged me so much I had to login in solidarity! You can tell these men are annoyed that Lorde is too famous for them to write "never heard of her", which is a favourite diss. I fully support them being outed.
Me to David. Of course I read and digest what you or your sidekicks have written but immediately go to the comment page and get more insight into the issue. At least this morning I’ve fed the cats first
Glad you are shining a light on that. I love her new song. NZ men have always been like this. It's taken until my 50s until it is sinking in that I wasted my entire life believing all the awful things men even said to me. When I was young and a very successful, worked globally as a sex worker and in the music industry around the world, I was treated horrendously by men in my non work world. Now that I'm ageing badly (stress and trauma) I look back at photos of my younger self and see how pretty I was and feel so sad how that girl had no self esteem because of asshole men. I have spoken to so many women over the years dealing with this shit. I hope younger girls don't loose their youth like some of us did to the abuse and shity things men say getting under our skin.
We shouldn't have to carry this burden, and yet it's so often the reality of being women. I'm 35 and slowly coming to better terms with this grief. Its so deeply shaped and directed my life. I hope that I can continue to embrace the glory of my younger self, she was so beautiful, and unravel what I've been taught by men. I feel so much of my life has been wasted by believing what men have taught me about myself, it's painful. May we all keep taking our time and power back.
👍 Absolutely! OUR JOB (if we have the bandwidth) is to help the younger ones coming through, just being "ordinary" or exposed to the toxicity of "fame" like Lorde - and I mean the "woke" men as well as the women who have already lived through the experience 👍🫂
Yeah, I like that. The idea of fostering ways of relating with one another -communityyy- that prioritises self-acceptance & empathy, encourages seeing ourselves from a place of wholeness & worthiness - This is the kind shit that lights me up!
Not just young women, and femmes-but older women and femmes I feel are just as important too!
🥹 Horrible how much damage toxic a$$holes can do, and sadly it is easier to do now to complete strangers because of social media - I wonder how these one's David have highlighted feel about being exposed?
My daughter is one of the young people in latest ACC/NZTA safe driving campaign. The comments attached to the Instagram version of the ad beggars belief. Fortunately she thinks they're stupid, especially after checking their accounts.
Oh, I am so sorry. That stuff still has to be hard for her to read. In saying that - she has the correct attitude. But that these comments even exist - AND FOR THAT AD OF ALL THINGS!
Honestly David, i dont think, in this case, these young men realise how sad and stupid they sound. Older men, in their 50s and 60s... they should just bloody well know better.
Good on you for showing who these twats are. There should be more of this. Expose the cowardly bastards...... Send this to their partners, and yes, this my real name!
Anytime I read a comment along the lines of ‘who??’ I can’t help but laugh, it’s such a telling on yourself moment. Like even my 92 year old Nana knows who Lorde is, pretending to not know is so embarrassing
Their “small dick energy” is on full display. Maybe if enough people reminded them, that they are projecting their smallness it would cause them to pause and not post
Bad behaviour needs push back or they will feel others agree with them
I’m happy to comment on physical appearance when it’s a choice - the amount of ugly eyewear on these blokes is too damn high. Imagine thinking Lorde sucks but these glasses are mint.
You get it.
Lorde’s first album came out the fall I moved out for the first time and went to college and it kind of feels like we’ve grown up together, her and I. Her music always speaks to me so much and I always go back and listen to Pure Heroine when I need to be reminded of that feeling of freedom and sense of self I had when I was 18 and had such optimism in my future. I can’t wait for her new music.
Fuck these dudes for real. It’s no wonder she needs years of reclusiveness between album releases.
I also CANNOT WAIT
You're right to call out New Zealand's men on this, but, and I'm sure most of us here know this, this is a worldwide issue. Comments like your examples are just the price female-presenting (or really, any non-white male presenting) people have to pay for existing publicly on the internet. And god forbid you're a fat human, or you're displaying any sign of sexuality or sensuality where men can see it. It's fucked. The internet can be and has been a great unifying and empowering force for humanity in a lot of ways, but it's also made it so easy for people to say horrible shit like this from behind a veil of relative anonymity and without repercussions.
Anyway, Lorde's new single is a bop and every time a man says something mean about her my love for her and her music increase tenfold. I hope she's ignoring all the hate and thriving.
Amen to this. Definitely a worldwide issue - although in looking at Lorde stuff, New Zealand news websites seem to have more instant awful, and more of the comments. So I think there is this short poppy thing tied into Lorde too, maybe?
I know this is probably one of the most obvious Webworms of all time - no revelations - but I do just think it can be fun looking at WHO is saying this stuff, and being reminded: "Who gives a shit what these fucking brussell sprouts are saying."
I feel the urgent need to defend brussels sprouts. I have them in my lunch today.
yeah, I love the actual vegetable... but it is hilarious as an insult
Gotta admit it's funny in context, though :) it's like calling somebody a "walnut"
Someone I care for a lot called me a walnut the other day for the first time. How I fuckin' laughed. So good.
Literally wholesome content.
Just because something's obvious doesn't mean it shouldn't be talked about! It is interesting and valuable to take a deeper look at phenomena like this, and to bring it out into the light. I think you've mentioned Lorde being singled out by the short poppy thing before, either here or somewhere else. Maybe being a successful NZ woman means she's getting even more shitty comments from NZ men who can't handle that double whammy.
Also, getting nerdy and putting on my anthropologist hat here (gotta get some use out of that expensive piece of paper I earned lol), the short poppies thing seems like it might have roots in before-the-internet times, when smaller groups of people had to engage in various forms of reciprocity to make sure resources were fairly evenly distributed among the group so everyone could survive. There are lots of ways cultures do that, but an important piece is making sure no individual takes more resources than everyone else, at least not long term. So in our modern times, someone like Lorde becoming successful and having a lot of "resources" (wealth, fame, access to food and goods, etc) flowing to her, might set off that deep ingrained urge in people to redistribute those resources more evenly among everyone. Not that that validates shitty comments from these fucking brussell sprouts, but could be a partial explanation for why the short poppy thing is a thing.
Really has interesting implications for our current situation in the US, with just a few brussell sprouts hoarding all the fucking resources. Seems to me there are much better targets available for cutting down than someone like Lorde who's just trying to make good music and earn a living.
That's a really interesting anthropological perspective. I wish people had the same naturally ingrained urge to cut down the white male billionaires currently holding all the power and resources. But apparently we like voting for them instead 🤷♀️
Yeah, well unfortunately humans can also be gullible and dumb... And the people who have all the money and power deliberately take advantage of that and convince us plebs that they have our best interests in mind so we'll vote for them (I'm using the royal we btw) and give them even more money and power as long as we can remain moderately comfortable. The tide will change eventually, and I think we're starting to see that, but who knows if there will be enough of a backlash to bring any meaningful redistribution of power and resources.
This is awesome - I'd never thought about the anthropological roots of Tall Poppy before, thank you!
Please keep in mind, I only have a BA in anthropology and I'm just musing here about possible links. I'm really more of a recreational anthropologist, definitely not an expert 😅 I do wonder if there are studies that address the short poppy syndrome though. Maybe I'll see if I can dig up some papers.
Like Amy somewhere else on this thread, I too, made an account so I can comment this! I'm immediately overwhelmed by new (to me) platforms so sorry if I if these points have been made, so fair my brain has been able to process "Amy" (hi Amy!), and "short poppies." --- But yes, I think the short poppies (tall poppies?) thing is definitely tied to it, and it's exacerbated by their misogyny. The older I get, the more I realize so many cishet white mens' biggest concern is often "leaving their legacy" or "making their mark" in some way, (while the rest of us are concerned with like, surviving, to varying degrees) and these douchenozzles have been telling themselves their whole lives that the only reason they haven't probably even TRIED to become international superstars is that New Zealand holds them back or whatever. So now a young woman goes and makes a HUGE fn hit and builds an international career so they can't handle someone who is supposed to be inferior (or, if they consider themselves progressive, someone who has had more obstacles than them) find traditional success/recognition. So they freak and PUNCH straight down. I also can't help but notice a lot of these guys are middle-aged-ish. I once read that this age demographic is the first time these men are experiencing a loss of power. And posting abusive bullshit about women and minorities online gives them that rush of power again, they subconsciously are resetting the balance, as they see it.
👍💯 Great first comment! & I 💜 "douchenozzles" 😁👏
this reminds me of an much more minor incident I was involved in about 10 years ago. at the time I was still a fashion photographer and had just started a non profit aimed at promoting inclusivity (of all ages, races, sizes, abilities, genders, etc) in the fashion sphere. I was part of a panel talk at Refinery29 on the changing state of gender in fashion (you can read about it here if you want for some reason https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/6-takeaways-from-the-changing-state-of-gender-in-127637323263.html?fr=sycsrp_catchall) and the comments across all platforms were BRUTAL from men. Mostly, I think, because they were mad that none of us were interested in them and somehow we all remained successful. I recall one especially lovely commenter (white male of course) who suggested that I should have been aborted - because I have... short hair? ok. It was WILD. What is wrong with straight, white men? Like, for real? Why were they even reading these articles??? Bizarre.
um of course I want to read about that... also dying that in the pic at that link you're just casually standing next to Jenny Shimizu (and a lot of other very cool people, but as a bi "girl" who grew up in the 90s, Jenny makes me swoon lol). anyway, crazy that women and queer people can thrive without keeping a man front and center in their thoughts, that must be so hard for them.
Jenny is a model agent so I worked with her all the time! Everyone on the panel was cool with the exception of one person who was very annoying but it was a panel full of humans so that's normal. PS men were also very mad they couldn't attend the talk which was like for women by women sigh.
I remember when some dude posted a photo of Lorde and her boyfriend (Asian) as a "whatdoy'allthinkofthis" and she responded with "what's your point?"
Honestly, some people are so toxic. How do they manage to live without poisoning the atmosphere and all around them? (Answer: they poison everything they touch, but some of us are impervious).
Of course there’s one who circled back to Jacinda. Every comment section on e-v-e-r-y topic is gross dudes who look like this ranting about Jacinda. It’s been fucking years.
Yeah, this is this constant in NZ news-website comments. Worms on the brain. Can't let go.
I see the AOC hate even here from New Zealand - often confusingly on unrelated things. E.g I was reading something about Franz Kafka the other day and the comment section was a guy saying “I bet AOC has never read metamorphosis!” It boggles my mind how obsessed these men are.
Thing is, Lorde is not singing for them, or about them, or recognising their existence in any way. As far as she is concerned, in their muddy camo, blue suits or novelty glasses, they are utterly irrelevant to everything she is.
That really gets their collective goat, and I am here for it.
Nail on the head there Sarah!!!
Tautoko!
I’d like to see the data cross section of : men feeling entitled to comment on women. Who also are single or abusive. Who like to cosplay army, or show their special skill, or have a close up vanity business shot on social media. Who also have a supercalifragilistic ego. Sorry, my bad. We’ve already got that, thanks David!
I have never commented on WW before but this has enraged me so much I had to login in solidarity! You can tell these men are annoyed that Lorde is too famous for them to write "never heard of her", which is a favourite diss. I fully support them being outed.
Glad this was the one that pushed you over the edge. I always find the comments here liberating and sane and smart. And fun, too.
Me to David. Of course I read and digest what you or your sidekicks have written but immediately go to the comment page and get more insight into the issue. At least this morning I’ve fed the cats first
Welcome Amy. Honestly the best part of the $69.69 is rolling around in the commentary compost with the other worms. Delish 🪱
And they wonder why we won't fuck them. Sigh.
And angrier and angrier they tend to get.
Glad you are shining a light on that. I love her new song. NZ men have always been like this. It's taken until my 50s until it is sinking in that I wasted my entire life believing all the awful things men even said to me. When I was young and a very successful, worked globally as a sex worker and in the music industry around the world, I was treated horrendously by men in my non work world. Now that I'm ageing badly (stress and trauma) I look back at photos of my younger self and see how pretty I was and feel so sad how that girl had no self esteem because of asshole men. I have spoken to so many women over the years dealing with this shit. I hope younger girls don't loose their youth like some of us did to the abuse and shity things men say getting under our skin.
We shouldn't have to carry this burden, and yet it's so often the reality of being women. I'm 35 and slowly coming to better terms with this grief. Its so deeply shaped and directed my life. I hope that I can continue to embrace the glory of my younger self, she was so beautiful, and unravel what I've been taught by men. I feel so much of my life has been wasted by believing what men have taught me about myself, it's painful. May we all keep taking our time and power back.
👍 Absolutely! OUR JOB (if we have the bandwidth) is to help the younger ones coming through, just being "ordinary" or exposed to the toxicity of "fame" like Lorde - and I mean the "woke" men as well as the women who have already lived through the experience 👍🫂
Yeah, I like that. The idea of fostering ways of relating with one another -communityyy- that prioritises self-acceptance & empathy, encourages seeing ourselves from a place of wholeness & worthiness - This is the kind shit that lights me up!
Not just young women, and femmes-but older women and femmes I feel are just as important too!
🥹 Horrible how much damage toxic a$$holes can do, and sadly it is easier to do now to complete strangers because of social media - I wonder how these one's David have highlighted feel about being exposed?
Why do assholes have all the confidence.
I just wonder if they ever take a moment of self-reflection, ever.
Usually the answer is 'no' or 'yes, but I hate what I see so much that I need to project some of that bile outward'.
They don't know how to.
I feel like Raymond would eat my liver with a glass of Chianti.
Nah, I reckon he'd do it with one of those obnoxiously pretentious hipster cocktails, but more likely a bottle of Passion Pop which is
A) more than he can afford
B) the only passion that fuck is likely to get
Lol Passion Pop. I used to love that stuff. The 90s version of Miami Cooler.
Dye residue on the hairline gets me
More like a FourLoko
My daughter is one of the young people in latest ACC/NZTA safe driving campaign. The comments attached to the Instagram version of the ad beggars belief. Fortunately she thinks they're stupid, especially after checking their accounts.
Oh, I am so sorry. That stuff still has to be hard for her to read. In saying that - she has the correct attitude. But that these comments even exist - AND FOR THAT AD OF ALL THINGS!
Gah.
Honestly David, i dont think, in this case, these young men realise how sad and stupid they sound. Older men, in their 50s and 60s... they should just bloody well know better.
Good on you for showing who these twats are. There should be more of this. Expose the cowardly bastards...... Send this to their partners, and yes, this my real name!
Anytime I read a comment along the lines of ‘who??’ I can’t help but laugh, it’s such a telling on yourself moment. Like even my 92 year old Nana knows who Lorde is, pretending to not know is so embarrassing
Oh yeah, the "Who?" brigade. That is definitely a type.
“Is this the one who sang Royals?”
You bloody well know who she is, you fucking bellend.
The Whos from Whoville
Omg it’s tinder .
God, I horrible. I'm sorry.
That was my first thought too 🤣 Nothing makes me want to go there ever again
Ha! Mine too! Nice to know it’s not just my algorithm. 😂
It’s always white balding men who are so confidently wrong and awful.
Confident stupidity.
Their “small dick energy” is on full display. Maybe if enough people reminded them, that they are projecting their smallness it would cause them to pause and not post
Bad behaviour needs push back or they will feel others agree with them