I'd love an alternate version of What We Do in the Shadows, where instead of a group of vampires, it's just a group of failing scam artists. Or maybe Thorn is like an energy vampire from the show and he's just doing this to feed off everyone who responds?
AT sounds like a narcissist with delusions of grandeur. I'll be sure to give him a wide berth.
Shoveling through all the piles of fraudulent drivel must be exhausting work David, make sure you practice good self care and remember we respect you and value what you do.
Thanks Fiona. I pop to see a therapist on occasion (a very privileged thing I can do). And I have some nice friends around me. I am lucky like that. Your kind words are nice too!
This dude is a study in shitheadedness - and a total scam artist to boot. It's hideous how such twats make us feel like crud by simply hurling abuse - but that's coz we (you) are decent and wouldn't think if doing such a thing to anyone. Coz you are not a shithead. Thanks heaps for this work that you do - one of the reasons I am so committed to supporting it is because I know how this crap feels - and all I do is review the internet and challenge people for icky stuff (via the same links you use, Companies Office, District Court records etc....handy stuff!) and I cop some regular abuse for it - especially during the election in the process of calling out the Billy T Bonkers crowd et al for their lies and rubbish - along with challenging other (gNat) stuff that was clearly crap. But I have the option of deleting people, and blocking them, and hiding from them. A luxury that, as a journalist, you do not allow yourself. For that you have my wholehearted admiration - and support - and empathy. Bullies farking suck the big sucky thing. HUGS!
I have vague memories of a pie in the sky "bring Tool to nz" Facebook event (maybe a page?) being around years ago, the type of event that people click yes to because it's appealing but obviously not going to happen. But then it changed and was a Silverback event and started promoting this event with this huge pre-built group of followers/attendees...which presumably can be leveraged to demonstrate the hype around a dubious event to potential parties who would perform/finance such a thing. This is a vague memory but the name Silverback is sparking it.
Inter-personally predatory individuals do seem quite alien to most us, so I totally get why people reach for labels like delusional or irrational. They are usually neither.
Sure, they will pretend to be mentally ill or impaired if they think it will help them avoid the consequence of their actions when caught. Hence the 'devil made me do it' or more recent 'meth made me do it' excuses. The most recent one is the 'autism made me to do it' excuse.
Non-neurotypical individuals on the autism spectrum already suffer from unwarranted stigma and prejudice, so I too find that claim offensive on both a personal and professional level.
But I digress.
Anyway, what we now call psychopathy or antisocial personality was initially called 'moral insanity' in that people where shocked at those who don't follow the social norms of reciprocal altruism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reciprocal_altruism like the rest of us since they are unburdened by conscience. No internal limits on their behaviour - all gas, no brakes in terms of going for what they want - which is usually money and power over others.
But unlike the truly irrational, they often are quite predictable and detectable if you know what to look for. Humans have evolved a set of intuitive emotional responses to detect human predators but we are often conditioned by modern society to override or ignore them.
Sudden shifts from glib verbal charm and evasion to naked threats is quite something to experience. When all pretence at friendliness isn't working and the mask drops, it's very chilling. That cold predatory gaze tells you that you are a 'thing' to them and you are angering them and getting in their way.
When someone shows you who they truly are, believe them!
Imagine trying to start a fight with a journalist who has both the curiosity and investigative skill to find out everything dumb or bad you've ever done and the audience to tell the whole of new zealand (and beyond) about it
Keep at it, David. You do the hard work for those of us who are sick of crap like this. I applaud and support you. Thank you for putting yourself out there.
Thanks so much. I enjoy the work, at times it gets tiresome/worrying - but happy to do it. I enjoy putting the bits together, and presenting it in a way that is - hopefully - entertaining and informative. The two can marry up quite well, imo - which is what I try to do in all my things!
It's interesting how reading about this "music festival" made me think of how each time there is a major gig at, say, Spark Arena, there's all these event pages popping up on Facebook, rife with scammers trying to sell you second-hand tickets they obviously don't have. Don't know why I made this analogy, it just seems to be a very similar vibe with "dodgy" and "scam" being the keywords...
By the way, David, I'm new here and I first became familiar with your work only about a month ago when you talked to NIN (my favourite band!) for their RRHOF induction. Truly an amazing interview and I've been a fan of your work and writing ever since (just about finished watching Dark Tourist now). Keep up the good work and I truly appreciate there is someone who keeps fighting bullies! We need more of that.
Hey W! There is a lot of dodgy out there. Thanks for the kind words, and thanks for watching the NIN chat. I felt really lucky when they reached out to make that happen - and it was a lot of fun. I wanted to serve the band and the fans well, and I think it went okay! Surreal seeing so many years experience all together on the one screen. And hey - thanks for reading my stuff here. It's what I do in between doc work, and chatting to bands I admire!
Seems the whole event thing is getting sketchier. Reputable promoters selling tickets for a year or more ahead, recently got one promoting March 2022! Of course, they have use of your money and with COVID a easy out for delay or just cancel/refund. Sometimes wonder if there is really any intention to hold the events.
Here's what I find fascinating. New Zealand is SUCH a small community. I've lived here for 13 years and two degrees of separation is accurate. So how do these people (Thorn, Lonely, etc) continue to find new markets after they show their truly horrible selves? Is part of it our quite relaxed approach to litigation, phoenix corporations, or just generally not wanting to be accused of cutting down tall poppies?
I definitely would buy a keyring that says "Will sue. Talk later." Also the clamping, did I have a fever dream or did you say we were going to get a follow up to that whole batshit saga?
You know, 'Will sue. Talk later' could work pretty well on a T-shirt/hoodie/etc too.
It's up there with 'Wormy piece of shit' IMO.
There's a whole line of merch just itching to get out here.
I have added it to the concepts.
It would sell well in the US :)
I particularly like this concept 😀
I'd love an alternate version of What We Do in the Shadows, where instead of a group of vampires, it's just a group of failing scam artists. Or maybe Thorn is like an energy vampire from the show and he's just doing this to feed off everyone who responds?
He’s definitely the energy vampire. I’ve heard the audio of that interview. It’s draining.
I really want to be friends with a couple called Will and Sue now so I can eventually say "will sue, talk later" to them.
I laughed more than I should have at this.
AT sounds like a narcissist with delusions of grandeur. I'll be sure to give him a wide berth.
Shoveling through all the piles of fraudulent drivel must be exhausting work David, make sure you practice good self care and remember we respect you and value what you do.
Thanks Fiona. I pop to see a therapist on occasion (a very privileged thing I can do). And I have some nice friends around me. I am lucky like that. Your kind words are nice too!
Reminds me of all the fyre festival quackery. This guy’s off his rocker.
Fyre Fest-lite.
This dude is a study in shitheadedness - and a total scam artist to boot. It's hideous how such twats make us feel like crud by simply hurling abuse - but that's coz we (you) are decent and wouldn't think if doing such a thing to anyone. Coz you are not a shithead. Thanks heaps for this work that you do - one of the reasons I am so committed to supporting it is because I know how this crap feels - and all I do is review the internet and challenge people for icky stuff (via the same links you use, Companies Office, District Court records etc....handy stuff!) and I cop some regular abuse for it - especially during the election in the process of calling out the Billy T Bonkers crowd et al for their lies and rubbish - along with challenging other (gNat) stuff that was clearly crap. But I have the option of deleting people, and blocking them, and hiding from them. A luxury that, as a journalist, you do not allow yourself. For that you have my wholehearted admiration - and support - and empathy. Bullies farking suck the big sucky thing. HUGS!
Kudos, Linda. Thanks for doing what you do, too.
I have vague memories of a pie in the sky "bring Tool to nz" Facebook event (maybe a page?) being around years ago, the type of event that people click yes to because it's appealing but obviously not going to happen. But then it changed and was a Silverback event and started promoting this event with this huge pre-built group of followers/attendees...which presumably can be leveraged to demonstrate the hype around a dubious event to potential parties who would perform/finance such a thing. This is a vague memory but the name Silverback is sparking it.
That’s him.
So intense. It's interesting psychology to go up against as you aren't dealing with anything rational.
Thank you for doing what you. A subscription to you will be a gift to a few people from me this year.
What you are doing is amazing ❤
You’re kind. Thanks!
Inter-personally predatory individuals do seem quite alien to most us, so I totally get why people reach for labels like delusional or irrational. They are usually neither.
Sure, they will pretend to be mentally ill or impaired if they think it will help them avoid the consequence of their actions when caught. Hence the 'devil made me do it' or more recent 'meth made me do it' excuses. The most recent one is the 'autism made me to do it' excuse.
https://toronto.citynews.ca/2020/11/17/backlash-grows-to-van-attack-perpetrators-autism-related-defence/
Non-neurotypical individuals on the autism spectrum already suffer from unwarranted stigma and prejudice, so I too find that claim offensive on both a personal and professional level.
But I digress.
Anyway, what we now call psychopathy or antisocial personality was initially called 'moral insanity' in that people where shocked at those who don't follow the social norms of reciprocal altruism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reciprocal_altruism like the rest of us since they are unburdened by conscience. No internal limits on their behaviour - all gas, no brakes in terms of going for what they want - which is usually money and power over others.
But unlike the truly irrational, they often are quite predictable and detectable if you know what to look for. Humans have evolved a set of intuitive emotional responses to detect human predators but we are often conditioned by modern society to override or ignore them.
Sudden shifts from glib verbal charm and evasion to naked threats is quite something to experience. When all pretence at friendliness isn't working and the mask drops, it's very chilling. That cold predatory gaze tells you that you are a 'thing' to them and you are angering them and getting in their way.
When someone shows you who they truly are, believe them!
In that vein (sorry, unintentional energy vampire pun), I recommend Gavin de Becker's book 'The Gift of Fear' https://www.amazon.com/Gift-Fear-Survival-Signals-Violence/dp/0440226198
Thanks Paul. Such great insight and resources
A subscription to webworm haha I will not subscribe people to you personally, promise!
Imagine trying to start a fight with a journalist who has both the curiosity and investigative skill to find out everything dumb or bad you've ever done and the audience to tell the whole of new zealand (and beyond) about it
He has a lot of self belief. If only put to better use.
Also with all the empty biz talk he throws in there I imagine he's like Bob Mortimers 'train guy'.
Keep at it, David. You do the hard work for those of us who are sick of crap like this. I applaud and support you. Thank you for putting yourself out there.
Thanks so much. I enjoy the work, at times it gets tiresome/worrying - but happy to do it. I enjoy putting the bits together, and presenting it in a way that is - hopefully - entertaining and informative. The two can marry up quite well, imo - which is what I try to do in all my things!
It's interesting how reading about this "music festival" made me think of how each time there is a major gig at, say, Spark Arena, there's all these event pages popping up on Facebook, rife with scammers trying to sell you second-hand tickets they obviously don't have. Don't know why I made this analogy, it just seems to be a very similar vibe with "dodgy" and "scam" being the keywords...
By the way, David, I'm new here and I first became familiar with your work only about a month ago when you talked to NIN (my favourite band!) for their RRHOF induction. Truly an amazing interview and I've been a fan of your work and writing ever since (just about finished watching Dark Tourist now). Keep up the good work and I truly appreciate there is someone who keeps fighting bullies! We need more of that.
Hey W! There is a lot of dodgy out there. Thanks for the kind words, and thanks for watching the NIN chat. I felt really lucky when they reached out to make that happen - and it was a lot of fun. I wanted to serve the band and the fans well, and I think it went okay! Surreal seeing so many years experience all together on the one screen. And hey - thanks for reading my stuff here. It's what I do in between doc work, and chatting to bands I admire!
Seems the whole event thing is getting sketchier. Reputable promoters selling tickets for a year or more ahead, recently got one promoting March 2022! Of course, they have use of your money and with COVID a easy out for delay or just cancel/refund. Sometimes wonder if there is really any intention to hold the events.
Here's what I find fascinating. New Zealand is SUCH a small community. I've lived here for 13 years and two degrees of separation is accurate. So how do these people (Thorn, Lonely, etc) continue to find new markets after they show their truly horrible selves? Is part of it our quite relaxed approach to litigation, phoenix corporations, or just generally not wanting to be accused of cutting down tall poppies?
As always David, love your work!
New Zealand is a weird kind of hell for this stuff. It’s all in plain sight, too
I think most of us are too trusting
Good old-fashioned grifting for the modern-era man.
Wow! Wonderful article David. Thank you. Is this the definition of delusional?
Not quite sure what it is. I have some opinions, but due to the legal threats just keeping all things to truth with less opinion.
Good point.
I definitely would buy a keyring that says "Will sue. Talk later." Also the clamping, did I have a fever dream or did you say we were going to get a follow up to that whole batshit saga?
I did! It is happening, just "slowly". There will be more!