If he wants deep pressure stimulation then he needs to buy a weighted blanket or a weighted stuffy like the rest of us do. A sensory sock or other deep pressure methods are also available. If he has high enough support needs to be asking random blokes (why always men?) to sit on him, he needs a carer because it is not safe for him or for others. His friend also needs to stop using resources from ABA to explain things, as ABA is regarded by the autistic community as abuse.
I have a whole rant about the way autistic men are allowed to get away with behaviour that autistic women are never allowed to [because of the way autistics perceived as boys and girls are treated as children], but I'll save that for another time. Any other autistic AFABs in here will probably immediately know at I mean though [because of our childhood experiences.]
Thank you for your thoughtful and informative comments, Rowan.
I received my bachelor’s degree in psychology recently and luckily when ABA was introduced, it was clear that it was abusive and not considered evidence-based treatment. At least in the class. In our department emails which advertise student jobs, most were for ABA positions.
why is “afab” at all necessary here? are autistic trans women NOT “autistic women”?? are autistic trans men “autistic women”?? why use oversimplified and inaccurate sex markers when you’re talking about gender? sorry for hijacking this comment, but it really baffles and upsets me when people use those labels. i’m yet to see a situation where they’re used that isn’t just transmisogynistic (whether intentional or unintentional) on its face.
I *am* a trans person. The way autistic people are treated and expected to behave when we are children is very different based on our birth sex, so I actually do think it is relevant. I understand why you may find it confronting, but it is something that is discussed quite a bit in autistic circles. I have edited my post to make it a bit more clear, however, that I'm talking about childhood experiences in that particular context.
Of course trans women are women, trans men are men and non-binary people are non-binary. There are actually also very interesting discussions about how the differing expectations and standards for autistic people of different genders can cause real difficulty for trans women once they transition [once again this is linked to childhood and the way kids are treated differently due to birth sex], but I don't particularly feel that was relevant to the discussion of this particular post and so I didn't mention it.
Rowan, you are a sweet Sweet angel taking time and energy to calmly expand and educate here. How you've explained things is important and clear. People can and should use AFAB/AMAB whenever they like. Thanks heaps, your AFAB Ally.
Oh my GOD this pisses me off to no fucking end. My 22 year old son has had thousands of seizures, starting right before he turned 5. He still has them regularly. One of my worst nightmares is that he'll have one around people who think he's faking it or being deliberately belligerent (and get arrested). It's people like THIS FUCKING GUY who make me worry so!
For those unaware: NEVER restrain a person having a seizure. You want to help? Put something soft under their head if they are on hard ground, turn them on their side, and let the damn thing play out. If it lasts longer than 5 minutes, call an ambulance. Also, there are a bunch of kinds of seizures - my son has full tonic-clonic seizures, but he is completely conscious through the whole thing. He just can't speak because his body is no longer under his control for a few minutes.
Swear all you like you have every right to, l work with people who have seizures and it's so debilitating and awful for them. For someone to pretend to do so for sexual gratification is beyond disgusting.
I thought exactly the same thing. My cousin has had epilepsy since she was bitten by a tick at age 3 and got meningitis. If more folks were trained in how to recognise and deal with seizures, arseholes like this wouldn’t get away with so much. The fact that he’s issuing clear instructions whilst “having a seizure” is just 🙄
My cousin is in Austria. We got the worst types of ticks when it comes to spreading potentially fatal diseases! Where was yours? It’s not to be trifled with!!
Sex work is legal in Australia! I hate that this guy won't just pay a provider to fulfill his needs rather than force this on unsuspecting bystanders who want to be helpful. I get that tricking people is most likely part of his kink, but this is so gross and wrong. Boo.
Yeah, I was thinking about this too! Also surely there is a way of connecting online with people who might consent to this? But like you say the public / tricking elements must be a part of it too. Sounds like he could do with some really good therapy!
Agreed! There are lids for almost every pot lol. There has been a guy in nyc (where I lived for 30 years) whose kink is rolling himself up in a rug and having people step on him at bars. He is well known around the goth scene and if you want to step on him you can, if you don’t want to obviously you do not. It’s all up front and out in the open (as much as it can be while in a carpet) and I think that guy has a much healthier approach and no one seems to hate him.
Sex work isn't legal in all states of Australia, though it is decriminalised in Victoria where this man is based. He should employ a professional service, though I assume he wouldn't be able to afford to do so on such a regular basis as he seems to be assaulting members of the public. We also have the NDIS service, which isn't perfect but if he is diagnosed as autistic, there is a framework that exists where he can access support, though not for sexual services (another kettle of fish that's been in the media recently, sexual services should absolutely be included in NDIS funding however I do not understand how anyone can expect to have a service included in a nationwide scheme that is still an illegal to provide in some states)
Thanks, AD. These are the sorts of stories I "like" telling (like is the wrong word, but). Things that are going on that have been going on forever, and they probably need to stop, but they raise a bunch of questions that we don't quite know how to answer.
There are two separate guys in New York City who roll themselves up in carpets, and ask and/or trick people into stepping on them. One of them claims it's not sexual, the other one says that it's definitely sexual. Apparently they hate each other.
I think Fake Seizure Guy is definitely committing sexual assault. He's just violating someone's consent through trickery instead of force.
Having had regular seizures for over 25 years this hits me hard on three fronts:
1. The thought of faking a condition that can easily cause death if the circumstances are wrong is simply morally awful. Layering that with taking advantage of people going out of their way to help… ugh.
2. I’ve been helped so often by absolute god-send strangers who’ve taken care of me, kept me from hurting myself any further, protected my stuff (yes, someone did try to nick my things once!), so it’s so sad that this guy could cause people to not offer help for fear of being assaulted.
3. Sometimes seizures can come with certain judgements; A&E doctors and nurses have suspected me of abusing drugs (understandable as they have to make sure they’re giving the right care) and have accused my family of abusing me thanks to black eyes etc. (again, understandable as it’s their duty of care). But I’d hate to think of a casual observer associating this guy with anyone who has seizures.
Overall, so much ugh. Fascinating pathologically. But ugh.
Am I a bad person for pretty much immediately thinking about how easy it would be to fuck with this guy? I don’t mean escalate the sexual element or physically harm him but like draw something on the back of his neck or be like “Oh I heard being splashed with blue Gatorade is really good for muscle spasms.” Yeah… I’m definitely a bad person but this guy has something coming.
One the one hand this is bloody fascinating eh. Like disturbing, but humans beings are so interesting and also creepy and weird. But then I think about how insular and online our lives have got, and the collapse of village or community life, and how vigilant anybody with a kid has to be about strangers and this fucking guy is making it so much worse. Like - a lot of the time now if you see someone in trouble the thought will flicker through your mind as to whether it’s safe to help, because it’s hard to know, and helpful people do get hurt. And the inverse, just wondering if something bad happened to me in public - would anybody come and try to help or have people like fake seizure guy contributed to ruining that also? I dunno, it’s Wednesday where I am and tbh I feel cranky af. Ugh. If someone who reads your article comes across this dude in real time - please call the police on the spot or trail this guy to his next location and do it there. But also please anyone who has had this happen - it’s not too late to file a report. Ps: David it’s moments like this when the name Webworm really comes home to roost coz this will be wriggling through my brain for DAYS. 🫠
Michelle - thanks. I like telling these stories which are so, so specific - but raise these bigger questions and ideas that can be applied to a bunch of potential situations. And as you say - this idea of "would I help" - and whether you rush in or ignore, or if it's safe, or if you're not helping because of the bystander effect, or cowardice, or because something *is* actually off.
The glove man of Halifax! So ICKY these men are GROSS. Not kink-shaming, do whatever you want, but don't do it on people that don't consent!
I used to work on an anonymous counselling line. There were lots of dodgy dudes calling about sex- and getting off on it- but my fave was 'tootsies' who asked me to describe my feet once. I told him, as an ex-ballet dancer, my feet were disgusting. He hung up. Perfect.
Stories like this are the reason I don't want to leave my house some times. It reminds me of a story a dear friend told me about growing up with a meth-addict mom. She would steal from people, like out of their cars or other accessible places. And if they came to her saying, "hey, have you seen my such and such? It's missing from my car." She would help them go around looking for it. Knowing full well she had taken it.
the mom of a friend was like this. she stole money from all of us. she also had the friend ask me for a $700 loan for food (that I knew was most likely for drugs) that I couldn't say no to. I'm so glad this friend finally got away from her toxic mother.
As a nurse, I've seen plenty of fake seizures but none like this since we'd medicate and not sit on. That being said, anyone having a seizure can't tell you they are having a seizure. Lol. People are so strange.
"That being said, anyone having a seizure can't tell you they are having a seizure" - thanks for this. And yeah, he offers very specific instructions throughout. Sit on me. Lie on me. Push into me. Grab my hands tighter. Etc.
What a crossover, I never expected to open a Webworm and see Christian Hull's name 😁 Fascinating story. We go about our routines every day and there are people out there doing all kinds of wild things. I love that I can still be surprised by people's antics!
Christian Hull was really great to talk to - very expressive. This will probably morph into a podcast episode at some point. As usual, it all starts here...
Wow this is really disturbing. Makes me wonder if there is a subculture of people who do stuff like this to lure people into an unwilling nonconsensual sex act. The fact that it's in public is that much more disturbing.
If he wants deep pressure stimulation then he needs to buy a weighted blanket or a weighted stuffy like the rest of us do. A sensory sock or other deep pressure methods are also available. If he has high enough support needs to be asking random blokes (why always men?) to sit on him, he needs a carer because it is not safe for him or for others. His friend also needs to stop using resources from ABA to explain things, as ABA is regarded by the autistic community as abuse.
I have a whole rant about the way autistic men are allowed to get away with behaviour that autistic women are never allowed to [because of the way autistics perceived as boys and girls are treated as children], but I'll save that for another time. Any other autistic AFABs in here will probably immediately know at I mean though [because of our childhood experiences.]
*Edited for clarity
Thanks for this clarity, Rowan. Pinning.
Thank you for your thoughtful and informative comments, Rowan.
I received my bachelor’s degree in psychology recently and luckily when ABA was introduced, it was clear that it was abusive and not considered evidence-based treatment. At least in the class. In our department emails which advertise student jobs, most were for ABA positions.
I didn't know about the ABA, Thank you
why is “afab” at all necessary here? are autistic trans women NOT “autistic women”?? are autistic trans men “autistic women”?? why use oversimplified and inaccurate sex markers when you’re talking about gender? sorry for hijacking this comment, but it really baffles and upsets me when people use those labels. i’m yet to see a situation where they’re used that isn’t just transmisogynistic (whether intentional or unintentional) on its face.
I *am* a trans person. The way autistic people are treated and expected to behave when we are children is very different based on our birth sex, so I actually do think it is relevant. I understand why you may find it confronting, but it is something that is discussed quite a bit in autistic circles. I have edited my post to make it a bit more clear, however, that I'm talking about childhood experiences in that particular context.
Of course trans women are women, trans men are men and non-binary people are non-binary. There are actually also very interesting discussions about how the differing expectations and standards for autistic people of different genders can cause real difficulty for trans women once they transition [once again this is linked to childhood and the way kids are treated differently due to birth sex], but I don't particularly feel that was relevant to the discussion of this particular post and so I didn't mention it.
Thanks Rowan - you are very clear here, and all good imo!
Rowan, you are a sweet Sweet angel taking time and energy to calmly expand and educate here. How you've explained things is important and clear. People can and should use AFAB/AMAB whenever they like. Thanks heaps, your AFAB Ally.
Oh my GOD this pisses me off to no fucking end. My 22 year old son has had thousands of seizures, starting right before he turned 5. He still has them regularly. One of my worst nightmares is that he'll have one around people who think he's faking it or being deliberately belligerent (and get arrested). It's people like THIS FUCKING GUY who make me worry so!
For those unaware: NEVER restrain a person having a seizure. You want to help? Put something soft under their head if they are on hard ground, turn them on their side, and let the damn thing play out. If it lasts longer than 5 minutes, call an ambulance. Also, there are a bunch of kinds of seizures - my son has full tonic-clonic seizures, but he is completely conscious through the whole thing. He just can't speak because his body is no longer under his control for a few minutes.
Pinning this. Thanks, Jess.
Whew! Had I known that I might not have sworn so much. HA!
Swear all you like you have every right to, l work with people who have seizures and it's so debilitating and awful for them. For someone to pretend to do so for sexual gratification is beyond disgusting.
I thought exactly the same thing. My cousin has had epilepsy since she was bitten by a tick at age 3 and got meningitis. If more folks were trained in how to recognise and deal with seizures, arseholes like this wouldn’t get away with so much. The fact that he’s issuing clear instructions whilst “having a seizure” is just 🙄
That's crazy, l know someone else that has had seizures since age 7 because of a tick bite.
My cousin is in Austria. We got the worst types of ticks when it comes to spreading potentially fatal diseases! Where was yours? It’s not to be trifled with!!
It was someone l know through my job, it happened in Australia. They developed a syndrome from the illness that came with many seizures.
I didn't notice any swearing, just an important psa
Didn’t notice the swearing, not a problem
Agree!
Swearing is, in context, 100% fine on Webworm and encouraged! A form of expression!
Sex work is legal in Australia! I hate that this guy won't just pay a provider to fulfill his needs rather than force this on unsuspecting bystanders who want to be helpful. I get that tricking people is most likely part of his kink, but this is so gross and wrong. Boo.
Yeah, I was thinking about this too! Also surely there is a way of connecting online with people who might consent to this? But like you say the public / tricking elements must be a part of it too. Sounds like he could do with some really good therapy!
Agreed! There are lids for almost every pot lol. There has been a guy in nyc (where I lived for 30 years) whose kink is rolling himself up in a rug and having people step on him at bars. He is well known around the goth scene and if you want to step on him you can, if you don’t want to obviously you do not. It’s all up front and out in the open (as much as it can be while in a carpet) and I think that guy has a much healthier approach and no one seems to hate him.
Sex work isn't legal in all states of Australia, though it is decriminalised in Victoria where this man is based. He should employ a professional service, though I assume he wouldn't be able to afford to do so on such a regular basis as he seems to be assaulting members of the public. We also have the NDIS service, which isn't perfect but if he is diagnosed as autistic, there is a framework that exists where he can access support, though not for sexual services (another kettle of fish that's been in the media recently, sexual services should absolutely be included in NDIS funding however I do not understand how anyone can expect to have a service included in a nationwide scheme that is still an illegal to provide in some states)
This is why I subscribe.
Thanks, AD. These are the sorts of stories I "like" telling (like is the wrong word, but). Things that are going on that have been going on forever, and they probably need to stop, but they raise a bunch of questions that we don't quite know how to answer.
Thanks for being here.
There are two separate guys in New York City who roll themselves up in carpets, and ask and/or trick people into stepping on them. One of them claims it's not sexual, the other one says that it's definitely sexual. Apparently they hate each other.
I think Fake Seizure Guy is definitely committing sexual assault. He's just violating someone's consent through trickery instead of force.
I love the idea that the two of them are the other's nemesis. This is a movie I'd love to watch.
The tag line could be: "Someone's going to cut a rug."
Or: "This time, the rug cuts back."
"Please DO tread on me"
Surely there is fanfic hiding somewhere in the dark recesses of the interwebs. Surely. I bet they wrote it too 😅
Scene: INTERIOR NIGHT: SMALL L.A. APARTMENT
[Over shoulder shot] Laptop screen (alone) illuminates person tapping on keyboard
[Slow Zoom to]: Screen with booking details for flight to New York as these characters are entered: D a v i d F a r r...
[Cut to:] LAX runway shot of aircraft departing...
... F a r r a r
Having had regular seizures for over 25 years this hits me hard on three fronts:
1. The thought of faking a condition that can easily cause death if the circumstances are wrong is simply morally awful. Layering that with taking advantage of people going out of their way to help… ugh.
2. I’ve been helped so often by absolute god-send strangers who’ve taken care of me, kept me from hurting myself any further, protected my stuff (yes, someone did try to nick my things once!), so it’s so sad that this guy could cause people to not offer help for fear of being assaulted.
3. Sometimes seizures can come with certain judgements; A&E doctors and nurses have suspected me of abusing drugs (understandable as they have to make sure they’re giving the right care) and have accused my family of abusing me thanks to black eyes etc. (again, understandable as it’s their duty of care). But I’d hate to think of a casual observer associating this guy with anyone who has seizures.
Overall, so much ugh. Fascinating pathologically. But ugh.
Am I a bad person for pretty much immediately thinking about how easy it would be to fuck with this guy? I don’t mean escalate the sexual element or physically harm him but like draw something on the back of his neck or be like “Oh I heard being splashed with blue Gatorade is really good for muscle spasms.” Yeah… I’m definitely a bad person but this guy has something coming.
One the one hand this is bloody fascinating eh. Like disturbing, but humans beings are so interesting and also creepy and weird. But then I think about how insular and online our lives have got, and the collapse of village or community life, and how vigilant anybody with a kid has to be about strangers and this fucking guy is making it so much worse. Like - a lot of the time now if you see someone in trouble the thought will flicker through your mind as to whether it’s safe to help, because it’s hard to know, and helpful people do get hurt. And the inverse, just wondering if something bad happened to me in public - would anybody come and try to help or have people like fake seizure guy contributed to ruining that also? I dunno, it’s Wednesday where I am and tbh I feel cranky af. Ugh. If someone who reads your article comes across this dude in real time - please call the police on the spot or trail this guy to his next location and do it there. But also please anyone who has had this happen - it’s not too late to file a report. Ps: David it’s moments like this when the name Webworm really comes home to roost coz this will be wriggling through my brain for DAYS. 🫠
Michelle - thanks. I like telling these stories which are so, so specific - but raise these bigger questions and ideas that can be applied to a bunch of potential situations. And as you say - this idea of "would I help" - and whether you rush in or ignore, or if it's safe, or if you're not helping because of the bystander effect, or cowardice, or because something *is* actually off.
https://www.reddit.com/r/halifax/comments/6qqr7c/warning_men_of_halifax_the_glove_man/?rdt=45305
The glove man of Halifax! So ICKY these men are GROSS. Not kink-shaming, do whatever you want, but don't do it on people that don't consent!
I used to work on an anonymous counselling line. There were lots of dodgy dudes calling about sex- and getting off on it- but my fave was 'tootsies' who asked me to describe my feet once. I told him, as an ex-ballet dancer, my feet were disgusting. He hung up. Perfect.
I think Ive had enough internet today.
Stories like this are the reason I don't want to leave my house some times. It reminds me of a story a dear friend told me about growing up with a meth-addict mom. She would steal from people, like out of their cars or other accessible places. And if they came to her saying, "hey, have you seen my such and such? It's missing from my car." She would help them go around looking for it. Knowing full well she had taken it.
Oh, that's really sad Frankie. Glad your friend has good friend like you.
the mom of a friend was like this. she stole money from all of us. she also had the friend ask me for a $700 loan for food (that I knew was most likely for drugs) that I couldn't say no to. I'm so glad this friend finally got away from her toxic mother.
Yes, same here.
As a nurse, I've seen plenty of fake seizures but none like this since we'd medicate and not sit on. That being said, anyone having a seizure can't tell you they are having a seizure. Lol. People are so strange.
"That being said, anyone having a seizure can't tell you they are having a seizure" - thanks for this. And yeah, he offers very specific instructions throughout. Sit on me. Lie on me. Push into me. Grab my hands tighter. Etc.
The awful thing about this is that it makes people reticent to help when someone DOES have a medical emergency.
I hope he's dealt with soon. This isn't one to just file under Melbourne weirdness and tolerate, this is one that needs to be stopped.
What a crossover, I never expected to open a Webworm and see Christian Hull's name 😁 Fascinating story. We go about our routines every day and there are people out there doing all kinds of wild things. I love that I can still be surprised by people's antics!
Christian Hull was really great to talk to - very expressive. This will probably morph into a podcast episode at some point. As usual, it all starts here...
People do need to educate themselves about seizures. When my son (12) had a seizure at school the school rang the police!
Lordy, a school really should know, huh. I hope this resolved OK... the cops aren't exactly speedy in their response times.
Wow this is really disturbing. Makes me wonder if there is a subculture of people who do stuff like this to lure people into an unwilling nonconsensual sex act. The fact that it's in public is that much more disturbing.